Barker/Johnsson Trade Reaction
by McClure on Feb 12, 2010 3:47 PM CST
172 comments
With the Olympic roster freeze happening today, and a much smaller window once the freeze ends after the Olympic tournament, it doesn't come as much of a shock that there were moves made today.
One of which was our beloved Blackhawks shipping defenseman Cam Barker to the Minnesota Wild for defenseman Kim Johnsson and their 2009 first round draft pick, defenseman prospect Nick Leddy. First, let's take a look at the exiting Barker. With his freshly signed 3-year $3 million contract in hand, Barker has for the most part underwhelmed this year after a solid offensive year last season, where he was statistically the team's best power play player. Niklas Hjalmarsson's emergence as Brian Campbell's permanent even strength partner relegated Barker to 3rd pair even strength minutes, and the power play's occasional struggles led to a lot of shuffling from Coach Q, and Barker often found himself on the outside of the numbers game. Furthermore his contract status and believed untapped potential made him ripe and juicy trade bait for other teams. In Minnesota, he'll get the top-4 minutes he'll need to fully blossom as a defenseman. Cam Barker will be a successful defenseman in this league for a long time with his size and offensive instincts, but something had to be sent away for the sake of keeping all of the big contracts on the books for a long time, and when he does, do not lament that the Hawks should have kept him. He simply didn't fit into the future plans of the top two pairings here. Barker's depature leaves the Hawks on the smallish side for their defensive corps, but he never really played to that size in the first place. And if the Hawks continue to dictate their puck possession game to the opposition, buckets full of brute force from the blue line won't be necessary.
In return, the Blackhawks get Kim Johnsson, a soon-to-be 34 year old defenseman in his 10th season in the league, now on his fourth team, with stops with the New York Rangers and Philadelphia prior to his now concluded stint in Minnesota. Most importantly, however, is that Johnsson is in the last year of a contract where this year's cap hit is $4.85 million, and will be coming off the books at season's end as an unrestricted free agent. From what I've observed of Johnsson, which is admittedly limited, is a positionally sound player with a fair amount of mobility, and a decent amount of offensive upside- so basically, an older, more offensively inclined Niklas Hjalmarsson. Here is what Bryan "BReynolds" Reynolds from Hockey Wilderness, SBN's Minnesota Wild affiliate had to say regarding Johnsson:
Johnsson has gained fans and trust here. He came into a team that could not get the puck out of the defensive zone to save their lives. Johnsson can do that. He is what could be called a prototypical "puck-moving" defenseman. This year, more so than any other, his contract has started to look worthwhile. With a new system in place, Johnsson’s puck moving abilities have been greatly valued. However, with his contract set to expire, it was obvious they would try to shop him.
You are getting a highly skilled puck mover who can easily QB a power play unit if need be. While his offense is not the greatest, he often sets up scoring plays with an outlet pass or by getting what would be called a "third assist." He is involved in the offense, just not in the finishing. His defense is second to none, so that will absolutely not be an issue.
I'd call that pretty glowing praise, wouldn't you? And if this gets Buff off the point on the man advantage and/or cuts down on Keith's workload, then this move works out even better. Here are the stats for Johnsson so far this year.
In addition to Johnsson, the Hawks also acquired the Wild's first round pick from this year's draft, defenseman Nick Leddy, who is currently playing at the University of Minnesota, who in 19 games has 1 goal and 4 assists in as a freshman, but has missed significant time due to a broken jaw. Pretty much every scouting report regarding Leddy uses some approximation of "world class skater", but at 5'11" and 180-ish lbs, he's on the smallish size. Leddy himself said he patterns his game after a couple of names that should be familiar:
Who does Leddy like among the current crop of NHL defensemen?
"I’d say Duncan Keith and Brian Campbell of the Chicago Blackhawks because they’re both really good offensive defensemen and both are kind of my style."
Obviously, Leddy is a long way off from the big show, but if it's Cambell who he's patterning his game after, if he does eventually make enough progress, he could prove to be Soupy's replacement in the very distant future.
Even before reading BReynolds' scouting report, I qualified this deal as a win for the Hawks. While Barker may turn out to be "a thing", it wasn't going to be here, and in return, the Hawks got real value for both this year's playoff push, and for the future. And, most importantly of all, a fair amount of cap relief for next season. While it remains to be seen just what and how much of it that Johnsson contributes to an already solid and deep defensive corps, I'm ready to give Hawks' GM Stan Bowman high marks already at first blush for this deal. So good luck in Minnesota, Cam, and welcome to Chicago, Kim.
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My reaction?
Giddy school-girl giggles now that the dead weight of Barker is gone.
He's the one they call Dr. Karpotsev...
That was my first reaction too...
But my later (sober) clinical analysis of this trade makes this an absolute win for us.
We add significant playoff experience for the playoffs.
We add a highly regarded prospect on defense
We shed salary and clear needed space for the next 2 years
We gave up an underperforming, overpaid 3rd pairing d-man
This is an absolute home run deal.
I woke up to this....
…Because I am a bum. Pretty damn good news if you ask me. Barker was the one guy I would have no qualms about getting rid of…and to get a very solid defensive defenseman to play with Sopel sounds good to me.
The one sad thing for me on this day is that I also woke up to trade rumors of us getting David Booth. Although, I heard nothing of the details and it kind of doesn’t make sense after I looked at his contract, I would have loved to see him in a Hawks uni.
by DudeMcnude on Feb 12, 2010 3:53 PM CST reply actions 1 recs
hah, me too
woke up right at the deadline. I’d say it was a good start to the day.
by gmh on Feb 12, 2010 5:06 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
not so much you on the rec'able
we were only 1 section apart and neither of us bought an expensive canadian beer for each other? wtf?
All right, come on, dummy, you won the game. Come on. Pick up your trophy.
Timbits?
God, I miss Munchkins. And we just weren’t allowed to bring alcohol to our seats. But, I’ll rec it anyway for mentioning Timbits, but being unsure.
All right, come on, dummy, you won the game. Come on. Pick up your trophy.
Dunkin coffee for sure, but i’m undecided on the doughnuts/beignets
All right, come on, dummy, you won the game. Come on. Pick up your trophy.
Dunkin's coffee it fuckin' terrible!
The best out of all of them is McDonald’s.
Let the Olympic spirit live in everyone.
GO CANADA GO!
Most widely-available coffee is terrible, but I happen to prefer the particular funk of Dunkin’s
All right, come on, dummy, you won the game. Come on. Pick up your trophy.
by meeshak on Feb 13, 2010 12:02 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
you woke up to this?
that is fucking rec’able
All right, come on, dummy, you won the game. Come on. Pick up your trophy.
No offense
to Barker, who played pretty damn good hockey for us last year. He has been a one-man clusterfuck at times this year, no doubt, but always came across as a decent guy. So I’m not gonna get on the “good-riddance” train.
But I have to agree with the majority of posters to the original brief on this item: a definite win for the Hawks on several fronts. Johnsson will improve us in several areas right away, and will give us cap room next season. Leddy shows nothing but upside right now, and if he continues to progress (and bulks up just a bit, as one would expect) he should pay huge dividends in the future.
teaching respect for the Indian, one Red Wings fan at a time.
Great Write-up...
…lucid, lots of great analysis. Once again, SCH is first on the scene with the intelligent breakdown. Bravo.
I know one guy who will definitely be happy...
that guy who was caught on camera (audio only) on CSNC – “Fuck you Barker!” Plain. As. Day. Resulting in mics being turned down and a slight awkward pause from Foley/Edzo. Anyone else catch that one? I think it was the PHX game.
Anywho…to echo McClure, great deal. I’m excited to see what Johnsson can do for us. Let the nicknaming begin!
"What the hell, let's review it." - Dale Tallon
"They are!" - Pat Foley
"What a farce." - Dale Tallon
by HawkVision on Feb 12, 2010 4:05 PM CST reply actions 1 recs
Yeah, I heard it...
There was an awkward pause and then Foley did the “nothing to see here folks” tone of voice as he tried to move on hoping no one heard it.
I've been a big fan of leddy...
If anyone has seen him, his skating is outstanding…. Could be a really nice pairing with Lalonde but will need a lot of seasoning.
It's called Sex Panther by Odeon. It's illegal in nine countries... Yep, it's made with bits of real panther, so you know it's good.
They've done studies, you know. 60% of the time it works, every time.
for those that don't know....
I believe Johnsson is pronounced YAHN SUHN (according to ESPN)
Many probably know this, but it is always annoying to be saying a name in your head and then find out that you’ve been saying it wrong.
"In an ideal world I would have all 10 fingers on my left hand so my right hand could just be a fist for punching."
then the hawks website says....
YAWN-suhn, I suppose I’ll just have to wait for Foley to verify.
"In an ideal world I would have all 10 fingers on my left hand so my right hand could just be a fist for punching."
Yes, J is typically pronounced in Swedish like a Y
Actually, the J in Hjalmarsson is purposely (mis)pronounced like the English letter J because the HJ pairing in Swedish produces a sound not used in English, and basically impossible to pronounce by non-Scandinavians.
Well, folks, I want to thank you for being here for the recording of my live comedy album. Funny material and laughter will be dubbed in later.
by ChicagoNativeSon on Feb 12, 2010 8:19 PM CST up reply actions
I wonder how Sportsgal is reacting.
Breaking all the windows in the garage?
Second City Hockey Most Postingest Poster of 2009
NOW STOP IT RIGHT HERE
People have more than one window in their garage?
Weird.
Mad? No. Sad? Yes. I have no idea if this will be a good trade for the Hawks. I know nothing about this Leddy kid, and I’m not thrilled that all we’re hearing about Johnsson is how good he is offensively. Hopefully we have a developing defenseman who is NHL ready next season.
"Another successful interaction with a man!" - Liz Lemon
those boys will be inconsolable. better bring chocolate to the next game.
All right, come on, dummy, you won the game. Come on. Pick up your trophy.
I think he meant the kids sitting in front of me.
They’ll be fine. Their memories are fleeting. I, on the other hand, will be bummed out for a few days.
I hope for our sake Hammer doesn’t take a step down next year (like Barker did) or we’re going to have major problems.
"Another successful interaction with a man!" - Liz Lemon
i forgot what it's like to be 6
probably because my memory fleeted.
All right, come on, dummy, you won the game. Come on. Pick up your trophy.
... it was an allusion to Catcher in the Rye.
Second City Hockey Most Postingest Poster of 2009
NOW STOP IT RIGHT HERE
request for previous Alkaline Trio / Cam Barker album cover
Whoever did that great album cover a while back should re-post that as a tribute to Cameron. From then on, I would always have that image after one of his fuckups and say to myself “goddamnit barker”.
Decent player though, and from the stories some of you have told about him, really good person. So I wish him the best of luck in the future (except those days when he’s playing against us).
TOI/game for Johnsson
23:46 total, leads Minnesota and is 25th in the league
2:58 PPTOI/g is 51st in the league
2:29 PKTOI/g is 77th in the league
At the very least, Johnsson will be able to eat some minutes and help keep some of the other guys fresh, and he’ll get some special teams time in as well.
"In an ideal world I would have all 10 fingers on my left hand so my right hand could just be a fist for punching."
I like the trade--wish it didn't have to happen.
I’ve gotten too attached to this team—really hate to see any one of them go. I like Cam, but he simply has been a letdown this year. I really thought he would move to the “next level” based on his play last year, but he seems to have regressed this season. He was the one guy I thought would be traded (and I was really fantasizing about the Niedermeyer possibility) so I expected this. Barker had played a few solid games lately, but it wasn’t enough. At this point in Barker’s career, Johnsson is the better player. Barker may end up great—but right now we need the production and the cap space.
And think how excited Johnsson must be to come here! He gets an instant upgrade to Cup contender. If he’s everything that Reynolds says he is, this could be an even bigger upgrade than stats indicate.
The real question will be Johnsson’s nickname. We’ll see what he inspires…
I think this is a very good trade - I like it more and more the longer I ponder it
This change of scenery may be exactly what Barker needs to blossom into a solid, true Top 4 D kind of player – befitting his #3 draft pick status. I just don’t think he’d have gotten a chance to do that here.
Yawn-Sun is a very solid/capable defenseman – not a great excitement guy, but the description as now being what you’d expect of a mature Hammer is quite apt by my reckoning. As I read the cap numbers, the deal is essentially a wash on the cap for this year (well, a $500k hit) – and sheds Barkers $3 mil hit for the next couple years (leaving about $6 or 7 mil more to go now for the summer’s Capocalypse).
Getting Leddy makes this one of those deals where, if Barker does indeed live up to his original promise elsewhere then we might ultimatey come to see this as a more of a Barker for Leddy trade – and be OK with it from that standpoint.
I can smell a fire-sale, a white flag
is going up. The goalie situation is too much to overcome, they are gonna unload everyone—including Eddie O’s hair piece
"Trying is the first step towards failure" Homer Simpson
that's not a hair piece
that’s stick tape
All right, come on, dummy, you won the game. Come on. Pick up your trophy.
I’m going to ask you the same question, but I’m guessing I won’t get a response.
All right, come on, dummy, you won the game. Come on. Pick up your trophy.
Haha...
Oh if only you saw my last response to one of your posts. Now THAT was a knee-slapper.
Do you mean
All right, come on, dummy, you won the game. Come on. Pick up your trophy.
by meeshak on Feb 13, 2010 4:27 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
It was a serious question. Serious answer.
All right, come on, dummy, you won the game. Come on. Pick up your trophy.
I wish I could rec this whole thread.
Well, folks, I want to thank you for being here for the recording of my live comedy album. Funny material and laughter will be dubbed in later.
by ChicagoNativeSon on Feb 13, 2010 7:13 PM CST up reply actions
The Shockwaves
Does this mean Buff is going to stay at the point on the PP?…….aaarrrggghhhhhhh!
"Whats your location Chief?"
"Well, Im on a road. Appears to be asphalt. I am directly under the Earth's sun......now."
So long Barker
I wish him well, he didn’t have the year I’m sure he wanted to. His fantastic play in the playoffs and the late offer deal helped set him up with a contract that he wasn’t able to live up to yet. It’s funny how the 2 guys that had such huge impacts in getting the Hawks as far as they did last year are both in Minnesota now. Can’t wait to see the big Johnsson.
So it was ok to hate Barker but not Huet........
"Trying is the first step towards failure" Homer Simpson
Yes
because as you can see, trading him was a doable thing, and will help the team.
2009 SCH Post Whore
2010 Troll Collector
SCH's Resident Mom
Well...
…just because something can be done, doesn’t mean it should be done. But in this case, can and should were in serious agreement.
Appreciate the rec from the other post, Trix. And yes, I do have a penis. Despite that, I still manage to appear intelligent sometimes, though we know appearances can be deceiving.
"Eighty-five percent of the fuckin' world's working. The other fifteen come out here." - Lee Elia
by TenMinuteMisconduct on Feb 12, 2010 7:38 PM CST up reply actions
You're free to hate whoever you like
But when you post about it here, if your reasoning sucks, be prepared to hear it.
Chicagoan in the Lou.
So happy no Turco...
I was getting nervous about that Turd…
"My Father's name is Jack, and my mother's name is Daniels..."
This news made my day!
I don’t think Barker is awful but he definitely hasn’t fit the Blackhawks’ style this year. And he’s way too pricey for the level he’s playing at. He’s going to play a lot better for the Wild, and I really think we’re going to see great things from Leddy.
So hooray for everyone! Good luck to Barker with the Wild (but not too much, you know) and welcome to our new guys.
Capology on a Friday afternoon sucks
Somebody help me out here: We are picking up a 4.8m contract here. Our cap hit for this year is pro-rated against the remainder of the season, right? And do we also absorb the cap hit for Barker for the time he was here?
Just trying to confirm that this ends the Rockford Shuffle situation that we saw at the beginning of the year.
Any other implications for this year that I’m not thinking of, cap/CBAwise?
WAIT FOR THE WHISTLE!
by Sec 326 Bureau Chief on Feb 12, 2010 5:50 PM CST via mobile reply actions
As I understand it - we picked up about a half million in cap hit this year
leaving us with about a half million more in cap space (and we have no LTIR space left)
the Rockford shuffle isn’t totally flatlined, but we’re real tight (particularly if anyone looks like he might be getting more bonus money than anticipated).
This confused me for a while too
We do take the hit for Barker’s time here, and Johnsson’s cap hit is pro-rated. According to nhlhumbers.com’s math, we have about 500k left under the cap.
Chicagoan in the Lou.
Hjammer is also Swedish
So Johnsson will have to be Swede Two, or maybe we just go with Sweet Tooth??
Well, folks, I want to thank you for being here for the recording of my live comedy album. Funny material and laughter will be dubbed in later.
by ChicagoNativeSon on Feb 12, 2010 8:30 PM CST up reply actions
Great move
Cam Barker was AWFUL all season long. He is poster child for unmotivated, unfilled promise. Let him rot in Minnesota.
Johnsson is a great acquisition. What the Hawks need most is somebody who can provide quality minutes at defenseman so Keith, Campbell, Hammer and to lesser extent Seabrook don’t melt. I love the fact that Stan Bowman acquired somebody who can move the puck….a GREAT fit for what this team wants to do.
The Blackhawks and the Stanley Cup in 2010.
While I agree that Barker had a poor season so far
He never struck me as unmotivated.
Buf? There is the picture of “unmotivated” most nights.
by krome on Feb 12, 2010 6:13 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
I just don’t see it myself, I truly don’t. I watch all the same games, I have the same passion for team … but I really have yet to see evidence of Buff’s lack of motivation.
www.mjt.org
Lately, Buff is has been average at best.
When he is motivated-when he gives a shit- he is flat out a man among boys. The evidence is he hasn’t done much to stand out.
"Trying is the first step towards failure" Homer Simpson
You Don't See Buff's Lazy Ass???!!!!
See if you can get some videos of last year’s playoffs or the winning goal he scored going past a defenseman (was it vs. Rangers in OT?) and compare that with 95% of his play this year. There’s your evidence. Is he worth keeping just for the playoffs?
If his play in the second season
is a difference maker in hoisting the Cup, then 82 games of mediocre play is more than worth putting up with. Maybe the team is waiting until this April to see what they have in Buff.
All right, come on, dummy, you won the game. Come on. Pick up your trophy.
Nowhere in my comment have I suggested he’s been as effective this year as he was during the playoffs; nowhere did I say there’s not room for improvement on his finishing ability. Nor have I argued about his presence, or lack thereof, in front of the net (it’s hard to get there when you’re on the point in the PP).
I have suggested this “lazy” and “unmotivated” shit is tiresome … because there’s no evidence, none, flat out zero … of him not trying.
www.mjt.org
I would agree. I think part of it is him not knowing how or when to apply himself best, and that can come off as being lazy. It doesn’t help that he seems to posture himself as being too cool to care during stoppages and after goals and what not. But I think that’s more his upbringing than any reflection of the way he actually plays the game.
All right, come on, dummy, you won the game. Come on. Pick up your trophy.
He has been aproject from the start, ie: defenseman turned into forward, which was done because he was afire drill in his own zone. If he can't play in front of the net and provide a screen what do you really have him for?
Mind the prickles, mind the dew, wash your willies, when your through. Miss the roses, miss the grass, Old Man Winter can kiss my ass. Always make sure your stick is active.
He does play the net when he’s on scoring lines. But that’s not his role on the checking and energy lines, his role is to be a large body hammering against opposing defensemen, to hit as much as possible, and to hold and keep possesion of the puck in the corners and behind the net, which he does well. He’s a fast, skilled 250-pound winger who’s good for 20 goals in a season, in just his 2nd year ever as a winger.
I don’t see how this value isn’t recognized.
www.mjt.org
I agree with all of that. I guess my biggest gripe is that he has a fat contract for what you get in return. And the goal of the Hawks brass is to maximize those dollars on the right players.
Mind the prickles, mind the dew, wash your willies, when your through. Miss the roses, miss the grass, Old Man Winter can kiss my ass. Always make sure your stick is active.
I don’t know. If you look at comparables he’s about $500,000 overpaid, if at all. What exactly are you expecting to “get in return”?
www.mjt.org
As you said he is a 250 pound winger who should be using that weight to make a hit on every shift, not when he feels like it. I personally like the guy but when you take some nights off and become invisible unlike other players on the team,
Mind the prickles, mind the dew, wash your willies, when your through. Miss the roses, miss the grass, Old Man Winter can kiss my ass. Always make sure your stick is active.
Then you are not worth the money.
Mind the prickles, mind the dew, wash your willies, when your through. Miss the roses, miss the grass, Old Man Winter can kiss my ass. Always make sure your stick is active.
Is there a reason you’re typing everything in the subject line?
Buff leads the team in hits!
It’s not like he goes out there on a shift and says to himself, Nah, I don’t feel like it this time. Even the superstars are invisible some nights.
www.mjt.org
I don.t believe he is doing that. I just think he needs to learn to be consistent with his effort. By the way I guess I should put glasses on before I start typing.
Mind the prickles, mind the dew, wash your willies, when your through. Miss the roses, miss the grass, Old Man Winter can kiss my ass. Always make sure your stick is active.
Next year you will have a player like Beach who is tearing it up in his Junior League now who will command far less dollars and give you the same size, hitting ability with the addition of scoring goals and not being afraid to throw the gloves down when needed.
Mind the prickles, mind the dew, wash your willies, when your through. Miss the roses, miss the grass, Old Man Winter can kiss my ass. Always make sure your stick is active.
Well, one hopes that’s what we’ll have. I have trouble laying that on his shoulders without his having played a single NHL game.
If he struggles with production will he too be lacking in effort?
www.mjt.org
I say that from everything I have seen or read about him. I look at point production as one part of effort. Hopefully the organization will have done it’s job to make sure he is ready to handle the NHL. Part of being ready for the NHL is realizing that you have to bring full effort in every game regardless of whether you score or not. Hitting, forechecking, and picking up your man in your own zone are all in the effort part.
Mind the prickles, mind the dew, wash your willies, when your through. Miss the roses, miss the grass, Old Man Winter can kiss my ass. Always make sure your stick is active.
Not to mention the fact that he is another player who makes a salary that does not equal what you get back from him. Your money is better spent elsewhere.
Mind the prickles, mind the dew, wash your willies, when your through. Miss the roses, miss the grass, Old Man Winter can kiss my ass. Always make sure your stick is active.
I think what Chico means
is that all the people calling Buff lazy are relying on the eye test (and dismissing goals/shots/hits/saves as him bogarting them) rather than more sophisticated evidence…
It might be a good point — it’s much more evident when a big man is lazy than a little guy (w/the exception of Kaner). For instance, we choose other labels for Kopecky, but we never really call him lazy.
Still, I think we can all agree Buff’s not playing up to his potential, and whatever the reason, we hope that something can clear up his play a bit. Maybe instead of yelling “shoot” or “skate” someone can come up with a one-syllable equivalent of “crash the net!”…
Playing up to your potential means being worth the money you are being paid. In this case you are overpaying for what you are getting in return. It all comes down to dollars.
Mind the prickles, mind the dew, wash your willies, when your through. Miss the roses, miss the grass, Old Man Winter can kiss my ass. Always make sure your stick is active.
I'd modify that a bit
It’s the money you’re paid vs the cost of moving you. Even before Phantom improved his play tremendously, you could’ve said that he was playing below his contract, but given his role and difficulty of moving him, he was still satisfactory.
Line nickname
Johnsson/Catfish – Old Balls.
angry bird is angry .
by Da'Ostrich on Feb 12, 2010 6:46 PM CST via mobile reply actions 2 recs
We just picked up a new TOFTBO
Swedish imports, indeed.
by Slaky on Feb 12, 2010 6:56 PM CST reply actions 2 recs
I don't like this
Granted Barker has had a down year, but I still think people were expecting too much too soon. Defensemen take longer to develop. I’m going to be extra pissed when he ends up winning a Norris or two down the road. We all saw the flashes of potential, but the Hawks never gave him the time he needed to get settled in.
If you want to see someone that needs to get moved, it’s Buf. I don’t care about the one or two nights a month he’s unstoppable, the bulk of the time he’s a waste of a skater (and absolutely painful to watch, I keep waiting for those ankles to snap). Yes, we’ve seen him be an absolute force at times, but how many shifts off a game does he take?
I’m not surprised, Tallon spent like a drunk sailor on shore leave and it’s going to burn us in the long run.
I think this is a typical response from fans who don't realize
that this is an annual affair
when you are a contender
in a cap space world.
Skapunknj, when you have a team with this much talent (realized and potential), you simply just can’t afford to keep them all and you don’t have the luxury to be patient with players whose development has faltered. That’s a luxury that a lesser team can afford them. Due to the cap, you need to be continually selling off commodities in order to meet short term needs, but just as importantly, to replenish your farm system in order to replace players when they get too expensive to keep. This trade fulfills both objectives at very little cost.
Unfortunately, we can’t be a bully in the playroom hoarding all the toys. Got to thicken up the skin and accept these perceived losses. I don’t always like them either.
Well, folks, I want to thank you for being here for the recording of my live comedy album. Funny material and laughter will be dubbed in later.
by ChicagoNativeSon on Feb 12, 2010 9:24 PM CST up reply actions
Agreed - but we have about $6 or 7 million in salary to shed soon
so Buf and Steg are likely on that short list (they make too much for their value to the team – but both likely have value elsewhere).
You're nuttier than squirrel shit
Cam Barker has had PLENTY of time to develop…and hasn’t. This season he has been downright awful. The Blackhawks are trying to win a Stanley Cup, not wait into infinity for Cam Barker to decide he wants to take hockey serious.
This was a great “win-now” move. I will live in zero fear of Cam Barker coming back to haunt.
The Blackhawks and the Stanley Cup in 2010.
Takes on average 400 games to to develope a d-man
Barker was at 200
"Trying is the first step towards failure" Homer Simpson
"Takes on average 400 games to to develope a d-man"
Source? Or is this one of your anecdotal observations?
Second City Hockey Most Postingest Poster of 2009
NOW STOP IT RIGHT HERE
Perhaps ccm is just a proponent of the guild system?
and therefore no statistical analysis necessary.
Well, folks, I want to thank you for being here for the recording of my live comedy album. Funny material and laughter will be dubbed in later.
by ChicagoNativeSon on Feb 12, 2010 9:51 PM CST up reply actions
Do they
get special kill moves when they reach a certain level?
2009 SCH Post Whore
2010 Troll Collector
SCH's Resident Mom
Yes, but according to this thread
Barker hasn’t earned enough XP yet. (although Marlboro 72 are close)
On the flip side, Catfish has well over 400 XP. I upgraded him weeks ago with max level Ninja skills. He’s so catlike and stealthy now, he actually appears to be standing still.
You can therefore be forgiven if you haven’t noticed ;)
Well, folks, I want to thank you for being here for the recording of my live comedy album. Funny material and laughter will be dubbed in later.
by ChicagoNativeSon on Feb 13, 2010 3:18 PM CST up reply actions
I don't have the patience
to level up my Pokemanz for that long. Can we google a speed hack? No? Forget it, he’s off my team. Yawnnie, I choose you!
THE CAP IS COMING! THE CAP IS COMING! REPENT ALL YE BANDWAGONERS FOR THE CAPOCALYPSE IS NEAR!
Lets look at the 2009 All-Stars D-Men
Total games played
Bouwmeester=532
Komisarek=395
Souray=650
Markov=597
Campbell=552
Weber=300
Lidstrom=1390
Boyle=655
Chara=826
Kaberle=795
Streit=339
Our two Olympic Defensemen
Keith=381
Seabrook=371
Next year there willbe considerable All -Star consieration for Keith/Seabrook who will be both at 400 plus games.
Again it takes approx 400 games to develope a D-man.
I am not saying at 400 games Barker definitely is a Quality D-Man. But at 200 games the jury is still out…..
"Trying is the first step towards failure" Homer Simpson
Again it takes approx 400 games to develope a D-man.
… to develop an all-star defenseman, I’ll grant you that. I don’t think any sort of Barker argument, for or against, should be operating in that stratosphere.
www.mjt.org
All star D MAY develop faster - they're the most gifted of players at D
Bobby Orr was a star from the start.
Although Chris Pronger was widely regarded as the worst #1 pick ever for his forst several years in the league.
Mid pack D takes several years to develop. 5 seasons may be it (on average), maybe it is more like 4. I don’t know which – but the point is valid.
by krome on Feb 13, 2010 12:34 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
5 seasons sounds about right
that’s one reason D stay in the minors so much longer than forwards
by krome on Feb 13, 2010 10:22 AM CST via mobile up reply actions
It's just a rule of thumb...
…what about Doughty?
Shit, Dunc was an all-star 2 years ago, and Seebs is still a kid.
Barker’s trajectory over the past 3 years has been a flatline- he lost time this year to Sopel and Hendry, let alone the young Nintendo blowing his doors off.
Great guy by all accounts, but I’d be surprised if he ever becomes more than a PP QB/ #4 in his own end. Ever.
by cliffkoroll on Feb 14, 2010 11:29 AM CST up reply actions
why do I feel like a round of "facts" coming on?
Tweets @ChiBlackhawks and blogs at Blackhawks Down Low.
by chiblackhawks on Feb 13, 2010 9:09 AM CST up reply actions 1 recs
Barker will get better
with more ice time. I still disagree with the 400 games for a d-man. There are a lot of top 4 defencemen playing right now. Seabrook was a #1 pair after one season. Just look at guys like Shea Weber and Ryan Suter, Even Hjalmarsson, he’s only played 80 or 90 NHL games and look where he’s at.
Competitive violence, that's why you're here!
Even if Barker does develop into a Norris winner
It wasn’t going to happen here.
Cam is costing us 3 million this year a next. If we wanted to continue to wait on him, chances are it would have cost us even more beyond that. After signing everyone we have, there is no way we would or could pay Cam more, so he would have walked.
This trade gives us a more seasoned defenseman for this season, creates cap room to sign Hammer or someone else, and gives us another top defensive prospect. So even if Barker does develop like you think he will, this was the best move for the Hawks to make in both the short and long term.
Chicagoan in the Lou.
by Mike Martin on Feb 12, 2010 7:52 PM CST up reply actions 6 recs
Great point
Also, though it would’ve been really nice for him to share the glory if we do well this year, I think it’s also much more fair to him to play somewhere where he can play higher up on the depth chart. In a way he was just as miscast as playing Versteeg on the checking line, or Kopecky on the 2nd.
No problem with this trade
I don’t dislike Barker, but he seemed to be regressing. Maybe everyone wins on this deal.
"Eighty-five percent of the fuckin' world's working. The other fifteen come out here." - Lee Elia
by TenMinuteMisconduct on Feb 12, 2010 7:22 PM CST reply actions
Ah Dammit!
I just bought a tie-dyed Barker jersey!
by HungryHungryPanda on Feb 12, 2010 7:22 PM CST reply actions
Adieu Cameron Barker
We’ll always have last year’s Calgary series. Too bad this year’s mediocrity overshadowed it. Best of luck to you – except when you’re playing us.
P.S. Tell Marty “hai!”
"FACEOFF!" "Makes the pass." "FIGHT!" - 8 bit hockey
HALLE-FRICKEN-LUJAH
From Sassone:
So much for Cam Barker returning to the point to help the power play out of its 0-for-20 slump.
But Dustin Byfuglien will be going back in front of the net after playing the point for the last few weeks.
“We like Buff’s shooting ability, but we also like his presence and his size in front of the net,” Joel Quenneville said. “We had to change the look when you go dry for six games or so. With a different look hopefully we can ignite it.”
There is hope.
by gmh on Feb 12, 2010 9:52 PM CST reply actions 3 recs
HALLE-FRICKEN-LUJAH
For a moment there, I thought I had missed a trade update
and those were the names on one of our new lines.
Well, folks, I want to thank you for being here for the recording of my live comedy album. Funny material and laughter will be dubbed in later.
by ChicagoNativeSon on Feb 12, 2010 9:55 PM CST up reply actions
Fuckin shit, finally!
Tremendously tremendous!
by allyouyounghockeyplayersoutthere on Feb 13, 2010 2:04 AM CST up reply actions
I am rec'ing this in the hope that
Q reads this shit and sees that we like what he’s doing. Or something. POSITIVE REINFORCEMENT, YO.
Tweets @ChiBlackhawks and blogs at Blackhawks Down Low.
by chiblackhawks on Feb 13, 2010 9:12 AM CST up reply actions
Veeeery interesting...
Earlier today Dirt closed out his article with
more dick jokes are coming soon, we promiseSoon after, we learn that the Hawks have traded for a guy named Johnsson.
Coincidence? Irony? Prognostication? Esoteric?
You be the judge…
Well, folks, I want to thank you for being here for the recording of my live comedy album. Funny material and laughter will be dubbed in later.
by ChicagoNativeSon on Feb 12, 2010 10:18 PM CST reply actions
I can't get past the fact that we now have a pair of (Swedish meat)balls.
Tweets @ChiBlackhawks and blogs at Blackhawks Down Low.
by chiblackhawks on Feb 13, 2010 9:13 AM CST up reply actions 2 recs
I am all for it...
…As mentioned before, we simply cant hold everyone. It just isn’t possible.
The thing I like most about this was mentioned above. Johnsson can eat into the minutes of the other D men. Currently Keith has only 5 games below 23 min, and already has 5 games over 30 min. He will also be playing a fairly important role on the Olympic team, which unless something completely bizarre happens will be playing late into the playoff rounds.
A "Leddy" tidbit
Who does Leddy like among the current crop of NHL defensemen?
"I’d say Duncan Keith and Brian Campbell of the Chicago Blackhawks because they’re both really good offensive defensemen and both are kind of my style."
source:
http://www.hockeysfuture.com/articles/10926/2009_prospects_nick_leddy/
"Trying is the first step towards failure" Homer Simpson
Are you stealing quotes from McClure's article which stole from chiblackhawks' comment?
by Katherine215 on Feb 13, 2010 9:38 AM CST up reply actions
Good Gatch
Mind the prickles, mind the dew, wash your willies, when your through. Miss the roses, miss the grass, Old Man Winter can kiss my ass. Always make sure your stick is active.
Sorry Good Catch
Mind the prickles, mind the dew, wash your willies, when your through. Miss the roses, miss the grass, Old Man Winter can kiss my ass. Always make sure your stick is active.
....reguardless I accept all complaints
…….I made a bad mistake
"Trying is the first step towards failure" Homer Simpson
random questions
in the playoffs, how do rosters work? As in, who is allowed to play for your team?
“At the end of the season, the Active Roster and Injured Reserve cease to exist; players cannot be placed on Injured Reserve during the playoffs, and there is no roster limit during the playoffs. Additionally, calculations for the purposes of determining compliance with the Upper Limit end upon the completion of the Regular Season. Therefore, a Club may use players whose Averaged Salaries exceed the Upper Limit during the playoffs – including any and all players who were designated for Long-Term Injured Reserve.”
Competitive violence, that's why you're here!
Last year
I remember all of a sudden seeing a bunch of players called up from the minors, and freaked out a little. But was told basically what cdz says above.
2009 SCH Post Whore
2010 Troll Collector
SCH's Resident Mom
cdz has it nailed
Mind the prickles, mind the dew, wash your willies, when your through. Miss the roses, miss the grass, Old Man Winter can kiss my ass. Always make sure your stick is active.
Barker
After reading the comments on this trade at various sites I can’t believe the number of fucking idiots out there who think that we gave up a perennial All-Star in Barker. He is never going to turn out to be more than he was with the Hawks, a third line defenseman. He may get top four minutes in Minnie but that won’t last long if he plays like he did here. He is a fire drill in his own zone and is slowwwww. He treats the puck like a fucking hand grenade and can’t wait to get rid of it no matter where it goes. You got a talented experienced dfenseman back and a decent prospect, you dumped cap money for next year. It is a fucking no brainer!!
Mind the prickles, mind the dew, wash your willies, when your through. Miss the roses, miss the grass, Old Man Winter can kiss my ass. Always make sure your stick is active.
what people seem to forget
is that we HAVE a solid top-four. Will we really continue to pay him top-four money for third-pair minutes?
Tweets @ChiBlackhawks and blogs at Blackhawks Down Low.
by chiblackhawks on Feb 13, 2010 9:14 AM CST up reply actions
Exactly. He was stealing money here. If your gonna take that money you better play like you deserve it which he did not.
Mind the prickles, mind the dew, wash your willies, when your through. Miss the roses, miss the grass, Old Man Winter can kiss my ass. Always make sure your stick is active.
He is next. If it wasn't for the fact that Dale was into his second bottle of Chivas that day we would not have that problem either.
Mind the prickles, mind the dew, wash your willies, when your through. Miss the roses, miss the grass, Old Man Winter can kiss my ass. Always make sure your stick is active.
In all fairness to Dale he was probably told to go out and spend like a drunken sailor. The only problem was at the time he probably was a drunken sailor.
Mind the prickles, mind the dew, wash your willies, when your through. Miss the roses, miss the grass, Old Man Winter can kiss my ass. Always make sure your stick is active.
I draw the line when we start to blame
a bottle of innocent Chivas.
"Trying is the first step towards failure" Homer Simpson
In fairness, his contract had absolutely zero to do with him, and much more to do with Dale’s understanding of the ways in which stamps differ from couriers.
I think the trade was necessary, and a win for us, but I also think Barker has the skill to a be a solid top-4 d-man someday.
www.mjt.org
We will agree to disagree on the last point.
Mind the prickles, mind the dew, wash your willies, when your through. Miss the roses, miss the grass, Old Man Winter can kiss my ass. Always make sure your stick is active.
Well, the guy had 40 points in 68 games last year … the skill is there. I think of him as a poor man’s Campbell in search of a partner who complements his style of play, which he never found here due to the glaring need to first find a partner for Campbell. Few defenders in this league are going to impress if they’re not fast and playing 3rd-pairing situations with Catfish besides. He’s never going to win all the races, but he does hit hard and plays the point in the offensive zone very well.
www.mjt.org
This is more of a league built on speed and puck control. Both are attributes which Barker did not have.
Mind the prickles, mind the dew, wash your willies, when your through. Miss the roses, miss the grass, Old Man Winter can kiss my ass. Always make sure your stick is active.
But don't we need a stay at home defensemen who can clear the front of the net?
"Trying is the first step towards failure" Homer Simpson
I'm not sure
that either of these guys fits the bill… Barker had the size but that wasn’t really his game…
I believe they will be looking at this area before July.
Mind the prickles, mind the dew, wash your willies, when your through. Miss the roses, miss the grass, Old Man Winter can kiss my ass. Always make sure your stick is active.
If you look at the way the Hawks have drafted recently andwith the prospect they got in the trade yesterday they value defensemen who have speed and can move the puck out of the zone. Again Barker did not fill that role.
Mind the prickles, mind the dew, wash your willies, when your through. Miss the roses, miss the grass, Old Man Winter can kiss my ass. Always make sure your stick is active.
That will also be why Sopel will not be here either even if he wants to sign for a lower salary
Mind the prickles, mind the dew, wash your willies, when your through. Miss the roses, miss the grass, Old Man Winter can kiss my ass. Always make sure your stick is active.
I have given thought to the fact that with the filing fuck-up, the big dollars he got and the constant rumors that he was either going to be gone via trade now or at the end of the year, he decided to pack it in.
Mind the prickles, mind the dew, wash your willies, when your through. Miss the roses, miss the grass, Old Man Winter can kiss my ass. Always make sure your stick is active.
bout to rewatch the phoenix game for that "FUCK YOU BARKER!" from the fan
anyone wanna help me out and give me a general time, period, etc that it might have occured?
I believe it was in the first period or maybe early second
Mind the prickles, mind the dew, wash your willies, when your through. Miss the roses, miss the grass, Old Man Winter can kiss my ass. Always make sure your stick is active.
thanks!
nhltorrents.co.uk is a great resource for those in the dark ages without a dvr
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