Blackhawk Blogger Summer Roundtable/Wet T-Shirt Contest
by McClure on Aug 3, 2010 7:00 PM CDT
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Now that the last round of shit has finally hit the fan, it's time we check the pulse elsewhere in the Blackhawks Blogging Community - a community which desperately needs a soup kitchen and a rehab facility, mind you. So with that, we offer up the thoughts of HockeeNight's Forklift, the eminently handsome John of The Fifth Feather, Jeff Bartl from Blackhawk Up, the unironically mulleted Chris Block from The Third Man In, and our very own Matthew Killion. Strap in motherfuckers, because there's a lot to cover after the jump.
Let's Go Voltron Force!
1) Now that we're in the immediate aftermath of the Capocalypseageddon, based on the moves we've seen so far, how would you grade Stan Bowman in this his first off-season at the helm under these hellacious salary cap circumstances?
Fork: I think he probably did the best he could to turn chicken shit into chicken salad. He was able to find teams that needed immediate help (Atlanta & Toronto) and take back some guys they could afford to wait on - DiDomenico & Morin both have the potential to be damn fine players in this league. In fact, you can even grade back to the Cam Barker for Nick Leddy & Dead Guy last spring as an example of being able to afford to wait for someone to mature.
Bartl: Bowman is in the unfortunate position of being viewed neutrally despite the fact his hands were pretty much tied. Either I'm giving too much credit to the Blackhawks' fan base by thinking the fans saw the cap-related moves coming, or I'm the naive one in the equation. The moves Bowman made needed to be made, or else the Blackhawks wouldn't be allowed to play hockey next season. Yet, the majority of people seem to be in wait-and-see mode pending the success of the 'Hawks next season. It's unfortunate because he did his best with what he was given. Not many first-year GMs would be able to pull off what he did while keeping the immediate core of a championship team intact.
John 5F: Well, as anyone with the internet and Cap Geek is well aware, Bowman needed to shed some salary to form any kind of competitive team. The three biggest criticisms he'll face going forward, in no particular order, are 1) saying Hjalmarsson and Niemi weren't going anywhere and offer sheets are extremely rare. 2) choosing to stick with a #3 center with a balky back over Byfuglien or Versteeg. 3) putting Nick Leddy on the fast track to the NHL. While he did get some value from all the salary dumps, he's had his share of hiccups so anything more than a C+ doesn't feel right.
Block: aside from allowing a 26-year old potential franchise goaltender to walk free, getting burned by Doug Wilson’s offer sheet and trading a 6’4" 260lbs game-changing power forward over a third line center with a weak spine, I’d say Stan did about as well as can be expected.
Killion: I'd have to say I'm pretty impressed so far. The Hawks were going to have a tough time fitting under the cap even before Toews had to go do something as selfish as winning the Conn Smythe. Bowman was put into an incredibly tough position - we knew salary needed to be dumped but so did everyone else in the league. A worse case scenario easily involved Bowman dumping pieces and getting trash in return. Instead he got rid of movable parts (plus Sopel) while getting a fair bit in return. The picks and prospects he received for Ladd, Buff, Steeg and the others could go a long way to keeping the team strong even as the main club continues to be successful (hopefully). You also have to give Bowman credit for making some moves that are insanely unpopular with a large part of the fanbase. It may just be the meatballs that don't understand why the Hawks couldn't keep guys like Niemi, Buff or Versteeg but they're every bit as loud as the other fans (if not more so) and their dollars count the same as everyone else's. Rather than make the popular move, he's made the move to make the teams stronger. They may not be as deep as they were last year but they shouldn't be too far off. I give Bowman fairly high marks so far and look forward to seeing what else he'll do.
2) What one move specifically do you feel will have the greatest impact, be it positive or negative, on the team as compared to last year's team?
Fork: Biggest impact, both positively and negatively, was the Hjalmarsson offer sheet match. Based upon the $3.25MM for one year that James Wisniewski just got, the $3.5MM/per for 4 years is just absolute highway fucking robbery. While this was the deal that meant the Hawks had to send Andrew Ladd to Atlanta - a negative impact, the Hawks blueline (once Seabrook is signed - and make no mistake, he will be) will be stacked for at least the next 4 years, meaning they can go the discount route on goaltending - a positive impact.
Bartl: I'm with Fork on this one. Doug Wilson's offer sheet to Hammer all but assured Niemi's exit because everyone knew Bowman would match it. At least I did, anyway. Bowman saying he's been looking at the possibility of signing Turco means it started pretty much around the time he committed to Hammer. The effect it had on the cap meant more players than he expected had to be moved. Keeping the top two pairings together for years to come was always more important than investing in a goaltender. Hammer's offer sheet simply expedited the process.
John 5F: Losing Byfuglien will hurt more than anyone cares to admit. But the greatest impact will be felt from Hjalmarsson's offer sheet. That extra million and a half really bit the Hawks, whether it was re-signing Niemi (you can openly question whether they had any motivation to do that now) or handcuffing them in being able to acquire some better players. It will be interesting going forward to see if there's any ill feelings between the Hawks front office and Hjalmarsson over this.
Block: While he’s getting he lessons in Hockey 101 from Sir Scotty Bowman, someone might want to clue John McDonough in that power forwards don’t reappear each season like vines on the Wrigley ivy. Since Al Secord, the Blackhawks have searched high and low, drafted busts and traded on a whim and a prayer to fill that void. Heck, even Bill Wirtz stepped out in 1995 and presented an offer sheet to a young Keith Tkachuk that, for one year, made the Winnipeg Jets winger the 2nd highest-paid player in the NHL behind Wayne Gretzky.
Remember these guys? Patrick Poulin, Ethan Moreau, Eric Lecompte, Jean-Yves Leroux, Chad Kilger, Chris Simon, Bob Probert, Wendel Clark, Martin Lapointe, Mark Bell, Michael Blunden and Ty Jones – All at some point drafted, or brought into the organization with idea they could be a deciding physical force in a playoff series and hopefully a championship team. Well, they finally got their man. And two weeks later, he was gone.
Killion: We're almost in the same place as we were last year - did Buff really find his calling in the post-season and will he learn to apply that to the 82 regular season game? If so, sending him away could hurt. Especially if Beach isn't ready to step up as a functioning member of society... and a power forward if we're really lucky. I think one of the biggest moves may be getting Turco to take such a huge pay cut. As I said above, he seems excited to be in Chicago but the contract is huge for a team that is going to be so close to the cap. It frees up space to allow the Hawks to be a little more flexible and could give players like Beach a chance to see if they're ready
3) Will Marty Turco and Corey Crawford be a serviceable replacement for Niemi and the obviously departing Cristobal Huet, and how much are you looking forward to the reaction of the meatball contingent the first time Turco lets in four?
Fork: Now playing the role of Meatball Hero - Corey Crawford! DEY GOTTA LET DAT CRAAAWWWFIRD PLAY! Hawks' backup goalie will loom large in Chicagoland legend along with Bears' clipboard holder and "scrappy" undersized white Cub. Last year the Hawks caught lightning in a bottle with Niemi - QStache took a goaltender who needs to work to stay sharp - Huet - and sat him for a month. He came back and was essentially useless. He can't make the same mistake with Turco and expect Crawford to bail him out. That being said, As long as they don't do anything crazy like give Turco #31, the meatballs should holster calling Turco a "sieve" for at least 2 bad outings. Which is at least 4 more than is rational.
Bartl: When you hear the boos for Turco the first time he's announced during starting lineups at the United Center, find the meatball closest to you and knock the living shit out of 'em. It's going to start from the beginning, and all us idiot bloggers will be writing the same shit next season about the meatballs, just replacing the names of the goaltenders. It's hilarious that the Blackhawks won a Cup dealing with goaltender bullshit all of last season, yet the meatballs will forget that championship so quickly so they have something to bitch about. Yes, Turco and Crawford will be more than serviceable replacements -- possibly even better than what the 'Hawks had last season. If a Huet/Niemi combo and back-stop a team to a Stanley Cup, there's no reason Turco/Crawford can't do it. I've already heard the argument regarding Turco's playoff struggles. Hm, doesn't that bullshit sound familiar?
John 5F: Where Niemi really shined last year, at least in the regular season, was in the shootout. There were countless times where he didn't have the greatest game but he came up big in the coin-tossing contest so everyone went home happy.
Walking away from Niemi, in my mind, says more about the organization’s belief in Crawford than anything else. If they didn’t have confidence that Crawford could give them 30 solid starts this season and possibly be their guy for the next 2-3 years, Niemi would still be here or Bowman would’ve locked Turco, or another goalie, down for a longer term.
As the Feather stated, no goalie did better in the shootout and Niemi’s willingness to battle between the pipes will be missed. This could get ugly in a hurry. Recenlty in Dallas, Turco didn’t get a ton of help, but he was bad a lot of nights. There will be a TON of pressure on Turco and the Hawks will truly need to win in spite of him frequently. Jersey buyers may want to wait until the trade deadline passes before they lay their plastic down for those Marty Turco sweaters.
Killion: Absolutely. There were times last year when Niemi was still unproven and Huet was still floundering when people were calling for the Hawks to trade for Turco. Our argument against it at the time wasn't so much that Turco wasn't that good (even though he wasn't that great last year) but that it didn't matter so much who the Hawks had in net as much as it did who the Hawks had playing in front of their goalie. Since the Hawks made the decision to keep Hammer, they've basically got the same defense and should be playing the same style. The Hawks aren't going to live and die by the way their goalies perform. Turco obviously is past his prime but he seems pretty excited to play here. We should obviously hope it adds a spark to his game and he has a bit of a resurgence but the season won't depend on it. Crawford has been the "goalie of the future" for far too long now. He's done alright in his few call ups so far but there should be a lot of pressure on him this year. Don't expect Turco to stick around past this year - Crawford will need to step up to show the Hawks can trust him with the starting role next season
4) Moving forward, what if any other moves would you like to see Stan Bowman make to round out the roster based on what's available within the system and in the remaining free agent pool?
Fork: Jordan Hendry's signing still hasn't been announced, but since he was at the Hawks' convention, I'm guessing he's part of the team. I'm not sure he & Scott fill me with confidence as a third pair, despite the entertainment the Murdersaurus (dammit, I'm going with this one until it catches on) can provide. I'm also curious to see if Kyle Beach earns a spot in the preseason, or if he spends some time in Rockford - the Turco signing means he'll fit under the Cap.
Bartl: I'm dying to see Kyle Beach in the Indian-head sweater. All the talk about him -- including from Bowman -- has me more than intrigued to see what he can do with the big club. A tough-ass with the ability to light up a score sheet? I wanna see it.
John 5F: We'd like to see a Lee Stempniak-type brought in, but Bowman has made it clear he wants a defensemen. The two guys who would seem to be the best fit would be Jay McKee and Andreas Lilja. Both are older, veteran defensemen with light cap hits. Either one would be suitable, just as long as Jassen Cullimore never touches a Blackhawks sweater ever again.
Block: The four sets of three up front are basically set now and that will take care of itself. Jack Skille could wind up sliding into Versteeg’s role in this group, or he could be back in Rockford for good by Thanksgiving. Stalberg will be useless when he isn’t scoring. You’ll know when that is. He’ll be the guy Quenneville is duck-taping to the bench. Beach shouldn’t be rushed just because the Hawks need size on the wing. Its best Stan allow this to naturally run its course and make the proper adjustments as the season runs along.
However, he needs another quality defensive-minded D-man to eat up the hard minutes Sopel leaves behind. Preferably a bigger body with a nasty side. The last thing Quenneville wants is Hendry or Campbell getting significant time on the PK and Keith and Seabrook cannot be asked to play more than they are already. When you already hear talk of John Scott’s versatility and history of pinch-hitting at forward, that tell you all you need to know about his abilities. Willie Mitchell is probably falls outside the Hawks’ budget. As fun as he’d be, Brendan Witt is a mess. Jay McKee fits the bill, but you can’t count on him to stay healthy. That said, Randy Jones would be the guy.
Killion: I'm sure everyone else is saying it - but the biggest hole in the roster is the spot left open by Sopel's trade. While Sopel sort of endeared himself to me during the playoffs he was obviously paid far too much and the Hawks desperately needed his cap space. They don't really have anyone that can fill in as that shot-blocking/PK machine but luckily those don't cost you an arm and a leg and with the Turco signing they should have the cap room they need to go pick up someone like Jay McKee. Beyond that, we'll probably see some shuffling of the roster sending guys back and forth to Rockford but the Hawks should be OK up until the trade deadline once they're able to see some weaknesses in the team as a whole.
5) Finally, what is Sam Fels doing during his month off?
Fork: He's touring the Midwest, telling the tale of post-Johnny Carson late-night television, where he celebrates the misunderstood genius of Jaywalking through interpretive dance.
Bartl: Pumping the neighbor's cat, wearing only a sleeveless flannel while holding a water pistol full of PBR in each hand singing "I Wanna Dance With Somebody" by Whitney Houston. Or something.
John 5F: Who knew that someone who runs a website and writes a publication two to three times a week for 7 months a year needs an entire month off? Our guess is he's scurrying the countryside in Ontario looking for Bob McGill to explain to him how he might be as awesome as him someday.
Block: 20 cities – 30 nights – Streaking home fields across the English Premier League.
Killion: If he's smart, he's certainly not watching the Cubs.
Thanks again to everyone who participated, and thanks to Sam Fels for not participating and allowing us to make him the butt of the joke.
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On a serious note
I look at the team top to bottom and am still very optimistic, this is still going to be a very good team, and fun to watch.
Well said dudes!
Finally a good piece. Pardon The Interruption take on the Hawks was horrible and made me want bludgeon in Tony Kornheiser head. Mike Wilbon took a positive side saying the Hawks core was awesome.. Time to buy a fucking hammer.
Ah geeeeaz, ah geeeeeez, ah geeeeez, oh crap.
When do you NOT want to kill Kornheiser?
by blackhawkeyes on Aug 3, 2010 10:09 PM CDT up reply actions
Since when did ESPN
“PTI” take on talking anything to do with hockey?
2009-2010 Stanley Cup Champions
Chicago Blackhawks
This time they did
Kornheriser was just bashing Stan Bowman saying that this is going to ruin the team and hockey in Chicago. Mike Wilsbon was basically telling Kornheiser to shut up. Out of all people Charles Barkley said it makes no difference how many people the Hawks lose(as long as there not the core). The core is amazing. So Mike Wilbon stuck up for us saying we’re still the shit and our core is amazing. He also told Kornheiser that in hockey the team is built around the core and fill in role players.
Ah geeeeaz, ah geeeeeez, ah geeeeez, oh crap.
this same conversation happened before
after the Buff & Co. trade to the thrashers. They do occasionally talk hockey,, and did more so this last year b/c the hawks were doing so well and Wilbon has to tout all things Chicago. This doesn’t mean they know what they’re talking about, but it has been more common in the past 6 months.
happy ninja is happy....and wants to share its new toy!
by puppetmasterp on Aug 4, 2010 1:52 PM CDT up reply actions
So...
Although the subject matter is in horse-flogging territory, to anyone who thinks the Hawks should have kept Byfuglien: What do you believe was the alternative? I see a lot chest-beating over Byfuglien, but I’ve yet to hear a rational option.
In terms of rational options...
I know of none, regardless of circumstance. But my argument for Buff has been that even if he remains invisible all year, every year his performance against Vancouver each of the last 2 years completely justified his sizable salary. If we were the Yankees we could just keep him well fed until Luongo, or the rangers, show up on the schedule
Afroman likes tall cans.
by OMFS88 on Aug 4, 2010 7:27 AM CDT via mobile up reply actions
based on the answers to the first question
John 5F and Block believe that Byfuglien >>>>> Bolland. So. That.
But when it was suggested to him that Toews v. Kane seems likely to become a sidebar to every future international hockey tournament, he smiled and said: "I'd like us to win something together, too." -- 2/28/10, so our Captain has said, and so it was done.
(Tweets @ChiBlackhawks and blogs at Blackhawks Down Low.)
by chiblackhawks on Aug 4, 2010 9:09 AM CDT up reply actions
I argue that overall, Bolland is much more valueable than Byfuglien was.
Buff was the big flashy plays-when-he-wants-to scorer who drove Lu and opposing FANS nuts. Bolland, however, while maybe not scoring as many goals in the playoffs(but overall, I think he had more in 09-10), he drove opposing PLAYERS nuts. Remeber watching the parade of Wonder Twins, Jumblo Joe, et al marching to the sinbin in retalitory fristration? Who shoved all the sand in thier vag? Holy Bolly.
Bolland has the ability to quietly get under the skin of a targeted opponent w/ ridiculous accuracy. I’d love to know what he says to these guys to get them so pissed off without fail. Is it insults to his wife? Ridicule of facial or genital features? Singing Lady Gaga? Whatever it is, it’s damn effective. Just watch some of the 2010 playoff games and key in on Bolly. You may not even notice it until the player’s already skating to AdSeg. Rewind it and follow along: you’ll wonder how you missed it in the first place. It’s highly amusing.
I think that bolland's irritation game
is more hacking and whacking, always on you, take out your skates (Mike Richards), post whistle slashes and whatnot. I remember one specific play in the cup finals in which Carter crashed the net, and as Niemi was freezing the puck, Bollie just whacked Carter’s stick out of his hands and slid the stick toward the boards so that Carter had to go and retrieve it.
If you’ve heard any of Bollie’s interviews, he doesn’t seem like the loud, witty button pusher that Burish is. It wouldn’t surprise me if Bolland hardly said anything to opposing centermen and wingers during the course of a game.
Ditto for CNS
That's the thing...
He seems so unassuming. I do remember the instance you’re talking about. He was pretty stonefaced when he did that. But check the two times I’m ref’ing w/ the Sedins and Thornton. He’s jawing w/ them. Specificaly watch for his interatcion w/ the Sedins. He breaks his stick crosschecking Bolly after he said something to him. I hope it was a comment about his goatee.
I re-watched several of the playoff games
focusing on Bolland. He does a lot of that stuff. That is what I love about his game.
I think I recall
Bollond telling Daniel that is brother was F’ing ugly.
by Fightin Werds on Aug 4, 2010 2:55 PM CDT up reply actions
I think it was Burwood who said that.
"It's the Chicago Blackhawks man." - Jeremy Roenick
by The Fearless Freep on Aug 4, 2010 3:00 PM CDT up reply actions
yeah, it was burish
But when it was suggested to him that Toews v. Kane seems likely to become a sidebar to every future international hockey tournament, he smiled and said: "I'd like us to win something together, too." -- 2/28/10, so our Captain has said, and so it was done.
(Tweets @ChiBlackhawks and blogs at Blackhawks Down Low.)
by chiblackhawks on Aug 4, 2010 3:57 PM CDT up reply actions
Ha, Awesome
Who shoved all the sand in thier vag? Holy Bolly
Way to make me chuckle at the end of a rough day.
Bahahahaha
The mental image of Bollie singing Bad Romance is absolutely priceless.
by Steven Schweickert on Aug 5, 2010 8:40 AM CDT up reply actions
See chi above
My only problem here is that Bolland wouldn’t have netted nearly as much in return as Buff did. I’ve been a Buff supporter for a long time and the net return is the only reason I was content with that move. I’m firmly in the Fifth Feather camp on this one, I think Buff will be sorely missed.
www.mjt.org
Holy crap
What’s up with all the blind Byfuglien love? He only did well when playing with Toews and Kane, which even I could do if put on that line. When you’re playing with all-stars, you’re gonna get points. It’s simple. I’d rather take a guy who was instrumental in shutting down the other teams’ top lines on a game-by-game basis while still being in the recovery phase of a back injury than a player with a knack for disappearing for huge stretches at a time.
What Buff did was great, no doubt about it, but Bolland is clearly the more valuable of the two, especially on a team lacking depth down the middle. I’ll take a responsible, consistent, PK-playing center over Buff any day of the week.
What's wrong with Byfuglie love?
Don’t be hatin’…
Agreed Bolland is the man, shows up for every game.
I’m assuming StanBow is fully aware of every minute detail of how Bolland’s “middle body surgery” is progressing, and I predict a breakout season for our 2 surgically repaired “makeovers”, Hossa and the Rat (sounds like a childrens book).
"What doesn't kill us makes us stronger."
Bolly's back
didnt look like it was bothering him and he has said that its stronger than it ever was before. what more do you people want? they guy is irreplaceable at this point on this team, especially given #11 is Departed and Bolly will get huge PK minutes this year. Sure, I cross my fingers his back holds together through the full 82 but at this point you have no reason to believe that it wont based on his progression and a full playoffs post injury with 0 issue. No reason other than being pessimistic, which is okay too I suppose.
If #36 is healthy for a full 82 games his value will be higher than #33 IMO when its all said and done. Is that much of an argument based on what we know Buff to be.
"...can i have a glass of whiskey and a slice of bread?"
I think it's based on how you view Bolland's recovery
and if the back becomes a bigger problem down the road.
But then again, it’s also based on how you view Byfuglien’s playoff performances thus far and how consistent you think he’ll be down the road.
Depending on whether or not Atlanta makes it to the playoffs, we may not know this year.
But when it was suggested to him that Toews v. Kane seems likely to become a sidebar to every future international hockey tournament, he smiled and said: "I'd like us to win something together, too." -- 2/28/10, so our Captain has said, and so it was done.
(Tweets @ChiBlackhawks and blogs at Blackhawks Down Low.)
by chiblackhawks on Aug 4, 2010 9:11 AM CDT up reply actions
How do you then view Bolland's recovery to this point then?
What I understand and what was written of Bolland’s surgery is that he is now completely pain free and stronger than he felt before the disc in his back was ever a problem. He has said that himself and in the playoffs, to me at least, he certainly showed it.
Where does the skepticism come in that he will not continue to play the way he did in the playoffs? I expect him to play as he did to finish the postseason. He’s 24 and has much more room to grow into a full season nightmare to the west.
I just hope to fuck we dont hear about him sitting out training camp and this and that due to a twinge or maitnence to his back. But as I said, it sounds like we are through with that. thus, optimism.
"...can i have a glass of whiskey and a slice of bread?"
I think people have Daze flashbacks
Once he started having back problems it was all downhill from there.
How would you like a job where, every time you make a mistake, a big red light goes on and 18,000 people boo?
I can't answer that
because everybody here knows I’m massively biased towards Bolland and I’m hopelessly optimistic about his situation because of that bias. But to be fair, he kept saying he was pain-free and it later turned out to be false (ie, when he was first asked at the beginning of the season, and then right after surgery, and then after he came back. In interviews after, he said he was still in pain after all.
That, and the Daze flashbacks.
Back problems are also pretty damn tricky to fix completely.
But when it was suggested to him that Toews v. Kane seems likely to become a sidebar to every future international hockey tournament, he smiled and said: "I'd like us to win something together, too." -- 2/28/10, so our Captain has said, and so it was done.
(Tweets @ChiBlackhawks and blogs at Blackhawks Down Low.)
by chiblackhawks on Aug 4, 2010 10:21 AM CDT up reply actions
Oh, about a week back
Maybe, just once, someone will call me 'Sir' without adding, 'You're making a scene."
all of the 08-09 season, apparently
But when it was suggested to him that Toews v. Kane seems likely to become a sidebar to every future international hockey tournament, he smiled and said: "I'd like us to win something together, too." -- 2/28/10, so our Captain has said, and so it was done.
(Tweets @ChiBlackhawks and blogs at Blackhawks Down Low.)
by chiblackhawks on Aug 4, 2010 10:36 AM CDT up reply actions
I don't how/why anyone would pick Buff over Bolland
A few of my thoughts;
The Hawks are deeper at power forward than center.
I don’t think Buff found his stride during the playoffs so much as he was lazy during the regular season.
While it’s true that during the playoffs Buff got inside Luongo and possibly Nabokov’s head, Bolland got inside Daniel Sedin and Thornton’s head enough to pretty much shut down their lines.
Bolland can kill penalties and turn a shorthanded situation to offense.
Buff averaged .415 points per game during the regular season while Bolland averaged .410.
They both averaged .727 points per game during the playoffs.
The only disadvantage I see about keeping Bolland is his back injury. Other than that, I see it as a no brainer on who the Hawks got rid of.
Maybe, just once, someone will call me 'Sir' without adding, 'You're making a scene."
Some more thoughts
The hawks dont really have a true power forward anymore. Not with Buff and Ladd gone now. Beach and Bickell might eventually become those roles…but we dont know. Buff had all the skills to be that quintessential “stand in front of the goalie and make his life hell” guy, but also far too much of the laziness that makes players irrelevant in system’s like the Bowmans’.
I point directly to the One-Man-PK-and-Shortie Bolland performed more than once.
Having said all this…I still miss Buff a great deal, but I would rather be able to watch a real hockey team next season than have those guys back.
by northernsails on Aug 7, 2010 11:48 PM CDT up reply actions
I have all the love in the world for Big Buff.
But he could not be kept given: a) his cap hit; and b) his trade value.
Let me repeat: He could not be kept given the circumstances.
AGAIN: THERE. WERE. NO. FUCKING. REALISTIC. OPTIONS.
Our Cup.
by 334Rules on Aug 4, 2010 5:29 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Frickin Tallon really screwed us, the Blackhawks and
Bowman by putting together a Stanley Cup team…the pain…the agony….the obivious aftermath
"Trying is the first step towards failure" Homer Simpson
That's what Bourbon is for, my friend.
Regarding your screen name,
Remember when the only hockey gear you could buy was either CCM or Bauer?
Super Tacks vs Supremes?
Do any of the youngsters know what CCM stands for?
Yup, I’m hammered…
"What doesn't kill us makes us stronger."
I know but I'm not
one of the old guys.
Maybe, just once, someone will call me 'Sir' without adding, 'You're making a scene."
How about
Northland and Victoriaville sticks?
Maybe, just once, someone will call me 'Sir' without adding, 'You're making a scene."
First sticks I ever used were Northlands.
Later switched to Kohos.
(I still have a couple of Northland shafts, one of which I carry with me as a “persuader” while I’m walking the dog. It helps fend off potential trouble in whatever form it may come.)
"Life is a long lesson in humility."
- James M. Barrie
kids on your lawn?
happy ninja is happy....and wants to share its new toy!
by puppetmasterp on Aug 5, 2010 11:30 AM CDT up reply actions
Never played ice hockey before
Cant skate worth a damn.
by northernsails on Aug 7, 2010 11:49 PM CDT up reply actions
Nestor Johnson
I was just talking about their equipment today. They made skates and all kinds of hockey stuff. Chicago company, now sadly long gone.
They should make younger kids use straight blades only
Until you learn how to shoot and stick handle. It pisses me off when you go into a store and HAVE to buy a curved stick. Wait until you’re a teenager.
Hell, teenagers know everything!
As a young goalie in the seventies, (insert Puppetmaster geezer joke here) Northlands Tony-O sticks were standard, I wish I still had one.
I still have a few Belfour Christian sticks from when I “retired”…
Are there any 50 and over leagues?
"What doesn't kill us makes us stronger."
We have some 70 YO playing in our over 40 league
Hockey is for everybody. Except assholes.
Holy Crap!
re: young kids and straight blades
when my son started (before he went the goalie route) he started with a straight blade for several months until he started to show an affinity to being a right handed shot. At that point his coach/instructor gave him a curved blade and now his puck-handling has gotten better.
"Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former."
-Albert Einstein
by tattoodgovtmonkey on Aug 4, 2010 9:00 PM CDT up reply actions
I may be mistaken
but I thought CCM stood for something like Canada Cycling and Motor Co. They were later bought out by a toy company called SLM International, who basically ran the operations into the ground. SLM Intl was listed on the NASDAQ as SLMI, which was appropriate given how they basically destroyed that company (Slimey…). I know cuz I was one of the idiots who actually invested in that company.
Assuming Byfuglie was serious.
"It's the Chicago Blackhawks man." - Jeremy Roenick
by The Fearless Freep on Aug 4, 2010 10:38 AM CDT up reply actions
following up
still own a couple of old black Hespeler Bernie Nicholls model sticks. Those were sweeeet.
"It's the Chicago Blackhawks man." - Jeremy Roenick
by The Fearless Freep on Aug 4, 2010 10:42 AM CDT up reply actions
I was very serious
AS I remember, Canadian Cycle and Motor. Most thought it was Canadian Custom Mfg.
I remember you could only get CCM or Bauer helmets, til Gretsky came along with that goofy looking Jofa Helmet.
"What doesn't kill us makes us stronger."
I had a Cooper helmet
The first thing I ever had from Cooper was one of those Plastic replacement blades. I remember when I was 10 or 11 and I put one on one of my broken sticks. I decided I wanted a curve, so I held it over an open flame on the stove. As I heated it up, I started to bend the blade for a curve. Then my mom walked into the kitchen and started yelling at me. At the time I thought she was overreacting but as I look back I guess the sight of a 10 year melting plastic over an open flame could be a bit upsetting.
Maybe, just once, someone will call me 'Sir' without adding, 'You're making a scene."
I had a Johnson helmet in junior high and high school.
Still have it around somewhere. Northland sticks and of course my TACKS! Oh how I loved my first pair of Super Tacks as a kid…
Remember the Stan Mikita helmets?
39 years of pain vaporized by one OT goal.
Dammm ! great call on the Cooper helmets!!!!
in fact I am going downstairs to see what I have left….after my Boubon of’course
"Trying is the first step towards failure" Homer Simpson
i thought bourbon was for something else...
like making me look good.
i take pride in owning ill fitting ccm jerseys, btw
Holy chocolate covered mammary glands, Batman!
Um, that's not chocolate, Boy Wonder
by JohnnyBourbon on Aug 4, 2010 2:10 PM CDT up reply actions
Be interesting to see what Crawford brings to the table
People forget that Niemi barely beat him out in training camp last season. It was basically a coin toss.
I'm not superstitious. I'm just a little stitious.
Rockford just got some new neighbors.
I was so preoccupied with all the goalie nonsense that it became so easy not to notice, but according to Hockeyfights.com as well as The 300 Level The Rockford IceHogs signed Zack Torquato, Andy Bohmbach, and Scott Fletcher to AHL/ECHL Contracts.
Torquato (21 yrs old, 6’0" 195lbs) is the real standout amongst this group. He was a former SCUM prospect drafted in 2007 and had been most recently playing for The Erie Otters of the OHL. Apparently he wasn’t progressing as fast as the experts in Detoilet were hoping and let him go before the start of the ‘09-’10 season.
After SCUM released him, however, Turquato decided to surpass his previous season’s point total by 30 points the following year, recording 31 Goals & 62 Assists amassing for 93 Pts in 68 Games. He then notched 3 Pts in 4 Playoff Games for Erie.
He’s seen limited AHL time in Grand Rapids and for the moment Turquato seems, much like Bohmbach, and Fletcher, destined to help fill the void created when the assumed Rockford “Newbies” join the big club (Skille, Dowell, Bickell, et all).
I can only take this, for now, that it means if there are any holes left to fill for Stan, unless its for an experienced PK/Shot-Blocking Machine D-man, they’ll be plugged up by the best our development systems can provide. Thankfully our development systems and wealth of prospects makes me feel a little more at ease for this type of situation.
So we’ve got that going for us, which is nice.
"It's The Chicago Blackhawks, man." ~ Jeremy Roenick, June 9th, 2010.
Look forward to seeing Sam's butt
at White Hart Lane in a couple of weeks then
The potential franchise goalie in Niemi
I’ve heard this argument several times, but I am at a loss at understanding how we can afford a franchise goalie with the team we expect to have for the next few years?
It's a terrible argument
He’d have been gone next year anyways or we’d be paying 4+ mil per year.
by Ban on Aug 4, 2010 9:43 AM CDT up reply actions
How many games will it take?
Will it be night 1 when the meatheads boo Turco? I will have to agree that it will be opening night when they announce his name.
2009-2010 Stanley Cup Champions
Chicago Blackhawks
I've thought about that last night actually
If I’m not mistaken, our first 2 games are away so if he can endear himself to the fans by pulling out a few good performances (winning), he should be ok when he gets to the UC.
by Ban on Aug 4, 2010 9:43 AM CDT up reply actions
I think it's just the one at Colorado
And then the home opener two days later against Scum.
Go jump in Toews Lake.
Aubrey: old German for king of the elves. Huff: English for...huff.
by shinkicker on Aug 4, 2010 10:32 AM CDT via mobile up reply actions
I really feel Turco is going surprise many naysayers this year
While I agree his regular season play has dropped off since the lock out, I don’t think he’s necessarily past his prime and he’s still very consistent. With the Hawks’ defense in front of him and his obvious desire to play for the Hawks and win a Cup, I’m looking forward to him having his best year since 2003. And if his playoff performance is anywhere near 06-07 or 07-08, watch out!
Lord Stanley's new address: Sweet Home Chicago!
by ChicagoNativeSon on Aug 4, 2010 11:16 AM CDT up reply actions
Someone give Block some cyanide
The guy seriously needs to start breathing into a paper bag until his heaving stops. The statements regarding Buff and Nemo belong in the Hall of Fame for overreaction.
“Since Al Secord, the Blackhawks have searched high and low, drafted busts and traded on a whim and a prayer to fill that void.”
Did he actually see Secord play? Making any comparison between Secord and Buff is truly insane – Secord would’ve fought Pronger tooth and nail for positioning in front of the net, not disappear like Buff did.
Thank You
for putting into words my sentiments regarding Blocks opinions.
I have to say that his writings in the CI are my least favorite. Seriously, does the guy like anything about the Hawks? The next positive thing he has to say about the team will be the first positive thing he has to say about them.
To read him you’d think we were a team of bumbling idiots, being led by bigger idiots, that just finished last in the league instead of the defending champions.
"Life is a long lesson in humility."
- James M. Barrie
hehe, it's kind of his thing
rumor has it when Block saw the Cup, he just crossed his arms and said, “Why isn’t this shiny enough?” And then later on, after the handlers polished it, he said it gleamed too bright.
But when it was suggested to him that Toews v. Kane seems likely to become a sidebar to every future international hockey tournament, he smiled and said: "I'd like us to win something together, too." -- 2/28/10, so our Captain has said, and so it was done.
(Tweets @ChiBlackhawks and blogs at Blackhawks Down Low.)
by chiblackhawks on Aug 5, 2010 11:33 AM CDT up reply actions
I have to agree completely.
No offense to Mr. Block (I actually thought for a short time that I might have gone to HS with him, but then I saw his photo – coincedental namesake) but as mentioned in my subject line, I agree.
His writings, although decently articulated and well-informed when discussing fact, tend to run right along the ledge and seemingly teeter precariously near falling/jumping off of it in my opinion, when opinion becomes the basis for them.
While many of us were “yelling” “TO THE CLIFFS” during the Championship run, I feet that his similar cries are directed to the ledge-jumpers.
Secord vs. Byfuglien? Holy fuck… People wouldn’t have been able to recognize the pieces of Byfuglien afterwards (and honestly, I LOVED the guy in our sweater). Secord would have battled Pronger, indeed.
Everyone dies. It is the only true and lasting justice in life.
Do all these roundtables end with parting shots at Sam?
If so… Don’t stop. ;-)
Fantastic work (not-so-)gentlemen.
by Steven Schweickert on Aug 4, 2010 8:51 AM CDT reply actions
Actually, they traditionally end with Sam taking a sideswipe at me, but since I QB’ed this bitch with Sam on sabbatical like he’s fucking Bill Watterson or something, turnabout becomes fair play.
Chicago Blackhawks - 2010 Stanley Cup Champions
Things have changed forever, we're the Ramblin' Boys of Pleasure
Wow Block, wow.
While he’s getting he lessons in Hockey 101 from Sir Scotty Bowman, someone might want to clue John McDonough in that power forwards don’t reappear each season like vines on the Wrigley ivy.
What are you implying? Do you think it was McDonough’s decision to ship Byfuglien out? Are you one of these Hawks fans that blindly hates McDonough and are determined to place blame on him no matter what?
Before I go into this, I’ll say that I appreciate what Buff brought this team in the last two playoff years.
Troy Brouwer is the best pure (empasis on pure to exclude Toews and Hoss) power forward the Hawks have, and he can do things that Byfuglien can’t. Show me a single playoff goal that Byfuglien scored that Troy Brouwer isn’t capable of……….I can’t think of any. Now I’ll throw 2 plays at you that I don’t think Byfuglien can make:
1) The first Hawks goal in game 6 this year against vancouver, the top shelf tip in off of sharp’s pass.
2) The 5th Hawks goal in game 1 against philly, TBrouw goes down on one knee and lifts one top shelf over the glove.
I know that you didn’t directly compare Buff and Brouwer, but you made it sound like Buff is this once in a generation power forward with all the tools, when he isn’t.
Buff was a great net presence for a bulk of the playoffs, but being a net presence is just as much about desire as it is genetics, and I’m comfortable with the thought that Troy Brouwer knows his role and will be what Byfuglien wasn’t: A solid puck winner, a power forward with hands, a backchecker, and a consistent net presence with the ability to put home difficult redirections.
Even if Bolland were traded first, I’m not convinced that I’d have kept Buff over a ladd, versteeg, or niemi.
Ditto for CNS
But all of the traded players were franchise players
That’s essentially his argument – no proof, just conjecture. And if he feels that strongly about it, he should tell us how he would’ve handled the cap situation differently. (crickets chirping)
his argument
is that Bolland should have been traded instead of Buff, so he does make that point.
Trading bolland would’ve allowed you to keep Buff, keeping Niemi would’ve still been an issue.
Ditto for CNS
AND...creating a BIGGER issue IMO
would have been the fact the ’Hawks losing a good checking centre.
The ‘Hawks haven’t exactly been deep at centre over the years and losing Bolly to keep Buff would simply show the ‘Hawks didn’t get it. Fortunately for us, they kept the right guy and as you point out, the Niemi salary issue would have still been there. Difference between Bolly and Buff salaries are only $338k.
Just win the next game...!
Bolland vs Byfuglien...
You definitely make the deal that Stan made.
Byfuglien might indeed turn into a legend somehow. At the same time, I somehow doubt it. The arguments made about each player’s “trade value” alone justify it to me.
When faced with Salary Cap issues as our boys were this summer, a sensible course of action is to make moves that a) lose salary and b) allow you some roster flexibility all at once.
Byfuglien (whom I LOVED in the playoffs) was not worth 3+ million dollars for his regular season production. He had an awesome playoff run and caught a lot of people’s attention with timely production. Look at his regular season, and compare it to the rest of the players in the league. He’s not worth the price tag he would have commanded.
Bolland has huge upside, and the questions about his health drove his price down. His play in the playoffs was also pretty awesome. The questions surrounding him will be answered by Christmastime, and we’ll know whether or not he appears to be completely the player that he was in the playoffs. If he is, then that’s great for us, if he’s not (and for the record, I believe that he is) then not any big deal, we let him go/trade him next season and draft a replacement for cheaper.
I think the right deal was made in this instance, and in several other instances this summer. We’ve still got Hjammer, we’ve still got Shooter, we’ve got a new “Goalie X” and we’ve got a ton of promising looking young kids in the system that are going to have some chances to learn with a young, championship caliber, amazing core of hockey players.
I am decidedly optimistic about the Hawks come the 2010-2011 season.
Everyone dies. It is the only true and lasting justice in life.
Thank you
Troy Brouwer is the best pure (empasis on pure to exclude Toews and Hoss) power forward the Hawks have, and he can do things that Byfuglien can’t.
When in Rome we shall do as the Romans, when in Hell we do shots at the bar.
by HolyBlackhawksBatman on Aug 4, 2010 9:44 AM CDT up reply actions
The third line D pairing is frightening me.
I won’t lie. Sopel as Killion mentioned will be missed big time.
Also, good call on the Hawks trying to find a solid power forward simply to let him go but then again how good is Buff without players like Toews and Kane? I am sure a few of the guys Block mentioned wouldn’t have been so shitty with those two on their line. .
2) choosing to stick with a #3 center with a balky back over Byfuglien or Versteeg.
I’ve been saying the same thing but realistically this team only has Toews and Rat as true centers.
When in Rome we shall do as the Romans, when in Hell we do shots at the bar.
by HolyBlackhawksBatman on Aug 4, 2010 9:43 AM CDT reply actions
No knock on Sopel.
I love the guy. But the Sopel/Hendry 3rd D pairing scared the shit out of most people for a majority of last season.
I really think we’ll be ok with the rotation of players that will likely be used in that capacity this year. Our angst may be relieved a bit when we see who the Hawks bring in for that last D spot on the roster.
"Life is a long lesson in humility."
- James M. Barrie
Also I am calling this now.
Bickell will be solid in the power forward role.
When in Rome we shall do as the Romans, when in Hell we do shots at the bar.
by HolyBlackhawksBatman on Aug 4, 2010 9:58 AM CDT reply actions
Giggle of the day
Sorry I couldn’t get a direct link to it, but if you go to NHL.com and click on the “what a pass” tab you can view a Toews to Hossa goal. This is the one where Edzo calls it a tremendously tremendous play. It was a sweet goal to watch and really made my morning.
How would you like a job where, every time you make a mistake, a big red light goes on and 18,000 people boo?
thanks
That was awesome to see again. A sweet goal indeed…one of my favorites of the season. Looking at the the final play, you’d think the Hawks were on a PP when they were actually shorthanded. If you look at the replay, even DK was in position to pot that one had Hossa been tied up. Amazing.
‽ ⅋ ‽
Hoss was hauling some serious ass on that play.
How would you like a job where, every time you make a mistake, a big red light goes on and 18,000 people boo?
no kidding
jesus christ he’s fast. I mean, I knew he could skate, and he he’s always flying in on the backcheck, but that was a whole nother gear there.
Looking at that makes me wonder where he ranks on the team in terms of raw speed. If Dunc, Campbell, and Hoss are going all out, who wins?
Before anyone answers that question, seriously watch Hoss on the bottom of the screen in that clip.
Ditto for CNS
and yet
he stops on a dime to plant himself in the perfect spot in front of the net.
happy ninja is happy....and wants to share its new toy!
by puppetmasterp on Aug 4, 2010 11:09 AM CDT up reply actions
bright side
We still have those guys on the team! Yeah us!
How would you like a job where, every time you make a mistake, a big red light goes on and 18,000 people boo?
Toews
took a three on three and turned it into a 3 on 1 in the Hawks favor. Man that kid is good!
"Every player should be accorded the privilege of at least one season with the Chicago Cubs. That's baseball as it should be played - in God's own sunshine. And that's really living." -- Alvin Dark
I think they have such different styles that it's hard to say
Campbell LOOKS the fastest, with Keith not far behind. But they both have more of a churning style of skating. Hossa just fucking glides effortlessly. I think Hoss is the fastest, but hard to say. This Stalberg looks like he can fly as well, and IIRC Skille can really move (but not much else).
"I have only space enough to add: against the assault of desperate pandas nothing can stand."
-ChicoMaki (channeling Mark Twain)
by HungryHungryPanda on Aug 4, 2010 12:44 PM CDT up reply actions
Speed
While we’re on that subject, in a recent “Power Ranking” of the fastest players in the NHL:
5. Patrick Kane
14. Brian Campbell
(number 1 was Andrew Cogliano of Edmonton)
Source: NHL’s Fastest
Granted, this is from the Bleacher Report so…yeah. Still kind of interesting.
‽ ⅋ ‽
I think Kane gets a lot of undeserved pub for his speed
I mean, he’s definitely fast, but I think of him as being more “quick”… or shifty… I mean, his Cup-winning goal was a perfect example. He didn’t beat Timonen with his speed, he beat him with a freaky-fast deke and shift.
"I have only space enough to add: against the assault of desperate pandas nothing can stand."
-ChicoMaki (channeling Mark Twain)
by HungryHungryPanda on Aug 4, 2010 2:08 PM CDT up reply actions
right
That’s exactly how I think of Kane. Uses quickness a lot more than flat out speed (although he is pretty damn fast too).
‽ ⅋ ‽
Haha... oh Bleacher Report
Here’s a sentence from the end of Andy McDonald’s profile:
The following is a clip that displays McDonald’s ability to use his speed to get himself in position to score against one of the game’s best goaltenders, Chris Mason.
Not only is Chris Mason NOT one of the best goalies in the league, the clip featured Steve Mason of CBJ.
"I have only space enough to add: against the assault of desperate pandas nothing can stand."
-ChicoMaki (channeling Mark Twain)
by HungryHungryPanda on Aug 4, 2010 2:43 PM CDT up reply actions
I think the best example of Kane's speed
is the Crosby backcheck in the Olympics. On offense I totally agree that Kane uses his quickness to make plays, but I think he’s still pretty fast when he actually goes all out
by blackhawkeyes on Aug 4, 2010 8:02 PM CDT up reply actions
good lord
why didn’t we trade HIM instead? That’s $6m we could have saved to keep both Buff AND Niemi!
But when it was suggested to him that Toews v. Kane seems likely to become a sidebar to every future international hockey tournament, he smiled and said: "I'd like us to win something together, too." -- 2/28/10, so our Captain has said, and so it was done.
(Tweets @ChiBlackhawks and blogs at Blackhawks Down Low.)
by chiblackhawks on Aug 5, 2010 11:35 AM CDT up reply actions
this was a thing of beauty
Too bad Olympic clips aren’t as accessible. I would love to see it again.
by TrialsBass on Aug 5, 2010 2:59 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
if this works, then tada (I was just watching the game earlier)!
by justforkicks on Aug 5, 2010 10:23 PM CDT up reply actions 3 recs
I'm a big kane fan.......
and I’ve never been more proud of that kid than I was when I watched that play.
Ditto for CNS
I am really looking forward to watching Panda play this season
now that the monkey is off his back.
Here's a YouTube link
Maybe, just once, someone will call me 'Sir' without adding, 'You're making a scene."
by cdz3210 on Aug 4, 2010 10:45 AM CDT up reply actions 2 recs
that is pure gold.
on that note, assume Hossa and Toews are one pair of PK forwards next year.
Who plays with Bolland on the other PK unit? Brouwer? Sharp? MADDEN?! no, thats not happening.
"...can i have a glass of whiskey and a slice of bread?"
Our PK could get interesting
Bolland and Sharp, I’d imagine, but who else? I don’t think I’ve ever seen Brouwer on the PK.
But when it was suggested to him that Toews v. Kane seems likely to become a sidebar to every future international hockey tournament, he smiled and said: "I'd like us to win something together, too." -- 2/28/10, so our Captain has said, and so it was done.
(Tweets @ChiBlackhawks and blogs at Blackhawks Down Low.)
by chiblackhawks on Aug 4, 2010 11:23 AM CDT up reply actions
Yes you have
EVERYBODY WANTS SOME. I WANT SOME TOO.
Chicago Blackhawks - 2010 Stanley Cup Champions
Things have changed forever, we're the Ramblin' Boys of Pleasure
by McClure on Aug 4, 2010 11:25 AM CDT up reply actions 3 recs
ohhhh how quickly i forget
mmm shorty.
/probably the only time you’d ever hear a lady say that.
But when it was suggested to him that Toews v. Kane seems likely to become a sidebar to every future international hockey tournament, he smiled and said: "I'd like us to win something together, too." -- 2/28/10, so our Captain has said, and so it was done.
(Tweets @ChiBlackhawks and blogs at Blackhawks Down Low.)
by chiblackhawks on Aug 4, 2010 11:28 AM CDT up reply actions
I think well see how well the new kids step in
Dowell? Bickell? They have some of the best to learn from.
2009-2010 Stanley Cup Champions
Chicago Blackhawks
Correct
Dowell’s first career goal was a shorty, I want to say. November of 2007, Thanksgiving night against Calgary.
Chicago Blackhawks - 2010 Stanley Cup Champions
Things have changed forever, we're the Ramblin' Boys of Pleasure
Damn
memory serves.
I would just assume they rotate that 4th PK forward spot. Bolland centers while Dowell/Sharp/Bickell come in and out. I dont know how much PK time Q wants to give Sharp. Use him in spots as a weapon on the PK when trailing or something like that but I do not want to see allll our highly paid and skilled players patrolling the PK.
Toews/Hossa/Bolland – 10’-11’ SH Goal over/under TOTAL – 15
"...can i have a glass of whiskey and a slice of bread?"
most times the hawks were running out 6 killers last year. some combination of hossa, toews, sharp, bolland, madden, fraser, burish, ladd. with people getting hurt and taking penalties i would see the need for 3 pairs.
toews/hossa
sharp/brower
bolland/dowell
with bickell as the 7th. bickell killed some penalties during his games up last season. and as mentioned above dowell has as well.
quibble
versteeg leaves a pk hole. He and Sharp were typically the third group out last year.
June 30, 2010. We will rue this day.
Versteeg
was also very good at taking David Bolland’s spot in the penalty box…
But when it was suggested to him that Toews v. Kane seems likely to become a sidebar to every future international hockey tournament, he smiled and said: "I'd like us to win something together, too." -- 2/28/10, so our Captain has said, and so it was done.
(Tweets @ChiBlackhawks and blogs at Blackhawks Down Low.)
by chiblackhawks on Aug 4, 2010 1:01 PM CDT up reply actions
so many things
we will miss about him
happy ninja is happy....and wants to share its new toy!
by puppetmasterp on Aug 4, 2010 2:02 PM CDT up reply actions
I could live with Toews and Hossa
as the other PK pair.
i would expect
a good face-off guy with Bolland (does he exist now that Reasoner is gone?) for the own zone draw. Madden did this last year.
Maybe Sharp’s as good as anyone in this role.
Otherwise, mebbe Toews moves up with Bolland, Hossa/Sharp as second pair, Bickell and ? third.
Hate to even thik about breaking up Toews/Hossa, but Q’s definitely gonna want a good FO man to start the PK.
June 30, 2010. We will rue this day.
I giggled at Bolland being a good FO man
49.4% in 09-10
44.4% in 08-09
46.5% in 07-08
Granted, some of it may be the back, but room to improve on the dot he has.
But when it was suggested to him that Toews v. Kane seems likely to become a sidebar to every future international hockey tournament, he smiled and said: "I'd like us to win something together, too." -- 2/28/10, so our Captain has said, and so it was done.
(Tweets @ChiBlackhawks and blogs at Blackhawks Down Low.)
by chiblackhawks on Aug 4, 2010 11:53 AM CDT up reply actions
You'd think Toews could
teach the man something?!
"Every player should be accorded the privilege of at least one season with the Chicago Cubs. That's baseball as it should be played - in God's own sunshine. And that's really living." -- Alvin Dark
"Just bend.... and SNAP!"
But when it was suggested to him that Toews v. Kane seems likely to become a sidebar to every future international hockey tournament, he smiled and said: "I'd like us to win something together, too." -- 2/28/10, so our Captain has said, and so it was done.
(Tweets @ChiBlackhawks and blogs at Blackhawks Down Low.)
by chiblackhawks on Aug 4, 2010 12:00 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
for the record
the comment above makes me very, very, VERY ashamed of myself.
But when it was suggested to him that Toews v. Kane seems likely to become a sidebar to every future international hockey tournament, he smiled and said: "I'd like us to win something together, too." -- 2/28/10, so our Captain has said, and so it was done.
(Tweets @ChiBlackhawks and blogs at Blackhawks Down Low.)
by chiblackhawks on Aug 4, 2010 12:00 PM CDT up reply actions
Well I laughed
You need less shame, Chi
Go jump in Toews Lake.
Aubrey: old German for king of the elves. Huff: English for...huff.
by shinkicker on Aug 4, 2010 12:04 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions
I laughed too
but some shame is necessary :)
"Every player should be accorded the privilege of at least one season with the Chicago Cubs. That's baseball as it should be played - in God's own sunshine. And that's really living." -- Alvin Dark
I laughed,
Blondes are funny…
/Note unceasing sarcastic laughter in background.
Fan of the 2010 Stanley Cup Champion Blackhawks!
Fan of the not 2010 Stanley Cup Champion Isles!
by burpchelischili on Aug 4, 2010 3:59 PM CDT up reply actions
did you think cliff was calling bolland a good face-off guy?
If so, I think he’s saying that Q should put a good face-off guy with bolland, not that bolland is a good FO guy.
Ditto for CNS
oops, misread
my bad.
But when it was suggested to him that Toews v. Kane seems likely to become a sidebar to every future international hockey tournament, he smiled and said: "I'd like us to win something together, too." -- 2/28/10, so our Captain has said, and so it was done.
(Tweets @ChiBlackhawks and blogs at Blackhawks Down Low.)
by chiblackhawks on Aug 4, 2010 12:03 PM CDT up reply actions
Bolland needs to become this FO man.
He has ridiculously awful percentages. Part of what he needs to develop is that FO ability we can rely on. He has had games where he was nails on FO but they are far outweighed. Hopefully he improves because he is certainly one of the top 4 PK f’s. Like Chi says…Hopefully with a healthy back he can tourque it a bit more on the draw.
if Dowell can take draws I say just put him out there in Maddens spot and keep Bolly on the wing on PK fo.
"...can i have a glass of whiskey and a slice of bread?"
Having not watched hockey for 2 months
I forgot how good this team is. the Tremendously Tremendous goal is just amazing.
by Katherine215 on Aug 4, 2010 11:39 AM CDT up reply actions
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uoMx_QMjIn0&feature=related
And because we love diversity around here, heres Marian Hossa being the shit out of some asshole when he was with Atlanta.
19-88-81-2-7-10-36-4-51 : The Hawks
HE LOOKS SO YOUNG!!!!!!
awww……….
happy ninja is happy....and wants to share its new toy!
by puppetmasterp on Aug 4, 2010 6:06 PM CDT up reply actions
I really miss hockey
Go jump in Toews Lake.
Aubrey: old German for king of the elves. Huff: English for...huff.
by shinkicker on Aug 4, 2010 10:59 AM CDT via mobile up reply actions
me too!!
It’s really been pretty boring since it’s not around, tired of the cap issues. I rather go back to disscussing last nights game.
2009-2010 Stanley Cup Champions
Chicago Blackhawks
Capology got old real fast
But I’m feeling pretty settled there. I’m glad the big moves appear to be over (but who knows)
Go jump in Toews Lake.
Aubrey: old German for king of the elves. Huff: English for...huff.
by shinkicker on Aug 4, 2010 11:24 AM CDT via mobile up reply actions
Reading the thoughts of the other bloggers
makes me even more appreciative of ours. Thanks guys and gal.
by stanfordron on Aug 4, 2010 11:21 AM CDT reply actions 4 recs
at the same time
I think it’s refreshing to get other views from knowledgeable Hawk fans.
Part of me feels like the SCH forum gets to a pretty good consensus because of input from lots of knowledgeable fans interacting.
But part of me wonders about a ‘groupthink’ mentality that sometimes gets a head of steam around here.
(It’s the “wisdom of crowds” vs. “mob mentality” distinction. A couple hot books right now on the subject.)
In my paranoid moments, I wonder if we’re all just puppets with Sam puling on the invisible strings.
Case in point, Bolland. Big fan here- totally agree with him as a core player (assuming back is ok). Guess who has a Bolland jersey, along with a man crush that verges on the awkward? SamFels, that’s who.
Anyway, refreshing food for thought from John and Block, tho I respectfully disagree (because Sam has manipulated my brain to do so.)
June 30, 2010. We will rue this day.
agree
i very much agree with you on the need to read differing opinions. it’s why my regular reads are sch and ff. i value people looking at things from different perspectives. plus, sometimes it’s just funny to see how two people can watch the same game and have two totally different opinions. it’s one of the great things about sports and life in general.
It's refreshing to get other views
EXCEPT WHEN THEY’RE WRONG.
And that is defined as anyone who disagrees with me.
:)
i am a puppet, but i pull my own strings, thank you
however, i do see your point. it’s the biggest reason i continue to listen to sports radio and watch ESPN, despite the narrow range of topics covered and more than a few uninformed opinions. Besides, it helps me figure out what exactly i disagree with, in a very concrete way.
happy ninja is happy....and wants to share its new toy!
by puppetmasterp on Aug 4, 2010 2:11 PM CDT up reply actions
Rec'd
well put!
"Every player should be accorded the privilege of at least one season with the Chicago Cubs. That's baseball as it should be played - in God's own sunshine. And that's really living." -- Alvin Dark
reply fail
reply to stanfordron. oops!
"Every player should be accorded the privilege of at least one season with the Chicago Cubs. That's baseball as it should be played - in God's own sunshine. And that's really living." -- Alvin Dark
Hawks sign five players
2 thoughts:
1) Look at Toivonen’s numbers. I know it’s only 5 games, but yikes.
2) Huge Jessiman, kind of sounds like “Huge Iceman”
That’s all I got.
Ditto for CNS
i know it may have been mentioned on here
But holy crap! Hugh Jessiman is one Huge Specimen
(see what i did there?)
Anyway, Jessiman, (26 yrs old, 6’6" 221lbs!!!) ranked third on the Milwaukee Admirals during the 2009-10 season with a career-high 20 goals, and third with a career-best 42 points, in 78 regular-season AHL contests.
No question those numbers won’t fully translate into 15+ Goals or Assists with the Big Club, but you never know. He may even start in Rockford with the rest of the newly signed come next season, but his size along with his statistical breakout last season makes the probability of him making the big club a tad more promising.
Hopefully it pans out for this guy, since a lot of people are still bent out of shape from loosing Big “The Prototypical Power Forward of Our Generation” Buff. If anything, we have filled out our “size” quota The Brass was so keen on in the recent draft ’cuz GOOD GOLLY MISS MOLLY THIS GUY IS GARGANTUAN!
Here’s a question for all of you: When Q decides to throw Scott out there with Jessiman as a linemante, can we just call them “The Red Wood Line” or maybe “The Ents Line” (Geek Alert! Tolkien reference! Geek Alert!)? Perhaps we get all Chicago-Proud about it and call them “The Big Shoulders Line”? Let me know!
"It's The Chicago Blackhawks, man." ~ Jeremy Roenick, June 9th, 2010.
Tall, yes - but not a lot of weight
Jeez, I mean, that’s quite a stringbean going on there. I don’t know if I’d use the word “gargantuan” in that context. What’s that guy on Boston go for these days? I’d say he probably isn’t as tall by any means, but he looked pretty Sasquatch to these eyes.
Chara is 6'9" 255
(or so yahoo says) So not much more meat on those bones.
And Tyler Myers is 6’8", 222. So they all seem to be of the beanpole mold.
Go jump in Toews Lake.
Aubrey: old German for king of the elves. Huff: English for...huff.
by shinkicker on Aug 5, 2010 10:41 AM CDT via mobile up reply actions
Never thought I would say this
but I’m starting to wish I lived in Rockford. That team is going to be a ton of fun to watch this year.
"Every player should be accorded the privilege of at least one season with the Chicago Cubs. That's baseball as it should be played - in God's own sunshine. And that's really living." -- Alvin Dark
Maybe wish the ice hogs were in Rosemont instead
Its a less alarming thought.
Go jump in Toews Lake.
Aubrey: old German for king of the elves. Huff: English for...huff.
by shinkicker on Aug 5, 2010 11:32 AM CDT via mobile up reply actions
"Even the trees walked in those movies"
- Randall Graves
Maybe, just once, someone will call me 'Sir' without adding, 'You're making a scene."
The Dent Line
For the man who was able to literally vault over opposing O-Lines.
by northernsails on Aug 8, 2010 2:02 AM CDT up reply actions
First of all...
Huge Specimen was his nickname before he was drafted.
Second, he sucks. He holds the dubious distinction of being the only first rounder from the 2006 draft to never play in an NHL game. Jessiman is simply roster filler for Rockford.
If he ever sees the inside of the United Center during the regular season in any capacity other than beer vendor, that means things have gone terribly wrong.
HOCKEENIGHT.COM...home of FRIDAY NIGHT FIGHTS and the HOCKEENIGHT PUCKCAST!!!
Question....
….I realize this could be an exercise in futility, but I’m curious what our SCH posters think about it.
If the NHL operated in a non-cap environment (or at least in a more liberal cap environment like the NBA), how good, and more importantly, for how long, could the Stanley Cup Championship Blackhawks be? Let’s think in terms of Cup Finals appearances, Cups won, etc. I know I’m probably getting way ahead of things in asking such a question, but….
This team had one of youngest core group of players as far as I can remember (Daydream Nation, Hammer, Marlboro 72), not to mention some very skilled players that are in their prime (Sharp, Hossa, Ladder). These guys could have played well together for a LOT of years. That said, I realize that some of these guys probably would not have been made available if it weren’t for the cap, like Hossa.
Nevertheless, I’ll throw it open…would this team be able to compete with the likes of the early 80s Islanders or mid-late 80’s Oilers?
"It's the Chicago Blackhawks man." - Jeremy Roenick
by The Fearless Freep on Aug 4, 2010 12:32 PM CDT reply actions
Hard to say.
It was a very different game back then.
Not talking about this Hawks team playing against those teams. I’m saying could this team win a number of cups if they could hold them all together….or is this question even relevant?
"It's the Chicago Blackhawks man." - Jeremy Roenick
by The Fearless Freep on Aug 4, 2010 12:48 PM CDT up reply actions
I think your question is too early...
we can still win like a dynasty, so let’s not count this new team out. Other than that, I generally lean to irrelevant-there will always be what ifs in sports, and I could think of several small ways the cup might not happen, like if a certain guy was still alive or if we didn’t win the 07 draft lottery…
on a side note, I do think it’s interesting that the Flyers would have had the first pick in ‘07 with the lowest point total in the league. It’s crazy how 3 years later these bottom feeder teams turned into Cup finalists and CHAMPIONS!
by blackhawkeyes on Aug 4, 2010 8:18 PM CDT up reply actions
yeah, the "History Will Be Made" commercial for the Cup Finals should have been
“What if Philadelphia got the 1st pick?”
But when it was suggested to him that Toews v. Kane seems likely to become a sidebar to every future international hockey tournament, he smiled and said: "I'd like us to win something together, too." -- 2/28/10, so our Captain has said, and so it was done.
(Tweets @ChiBlackhawks and blogs at Blackhawks Down Low.)
by chiblackhawks on Aug 5, 2010 11:36 AM CDT up reply actions
or would they be
the 1960s Blackhawks? I know it’s not easy, but I like the system that’s in place. I don’t want to watch the same team winning year after year in any sport, and I like that the salaries aren’t completely ridiculous like in other sports.
by Katherine215 on Aug 4, 2010 12:49 PM CDT up reply actions
to be fair to the cap
we wouldn’t be the 2010 Stanley Cup Champions.
Hossa might never have left the Red Wings. We might have decided to keep Havlat. The Flyers might never have decided to do a cap dump and get Matt Ellison from us in exchange for Patrick Sharp. Etc.
But when it was suggested to him that Toews v. Kane seems likely to become a sidebar to every future international hockey tournament, he smiled and said: "I'd like us to win something together, too." -- 2/28/10, so our Captain has said, and so it was done.
(Tweets @ChiBlackhawks and blogs at Blackhawks Down Low.)
by chiblackhawks on Aug 4, 2010 1:08 PM CDT up reply actions
Yeah – see, that’s what I mean – I guess it is sort of an irrelevant question.
"It's the Chicago Blackhawks man." - Jeremy Roenick
by The Fearless Freep on Aug 4, 2010 1:13 PM CDT up reply actions
Ladd's actually younger than Marlboro 72
Barely, in the case of Biscuit, but yeah, dude is not yet 25. And has his name on the Cup twice.
So I’m not sure which group he should be in.
Go jump in Toews Lake.
Aubrey: old German for king of the elves. Huff: English for...huff.
by shinkicker on Aug 4, 2010 2:07 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions
he's in the group of people
who make me wonder what the hell i’ve done with my life thus far….
happy ninja is happy....and wants to share its new toy!
by puppetmasterp on Aug 4, 2010 2:16 PM CDT up reply actions
President of that club:
J. Toews?
Go jump in Toews Lake.
Aubrey: old German for king of the elves. Huff: English for...huff.
by shinkicker on Aug 4, 2010 2:41 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions
Da Hawks
would win an infinite number of Stanley Cups. Dere, I said it. And I didn’t even have my 37th heart attack.
Our Cup.
Pick 'em from recent history
76-79 Habs
80-83 Isles
84,5,7,8,90 Oil
Think about the core players and the fact guys like Niemi, Ladd, Buff, Sopes & Steeger still being here while Lalonde, Skille, Bickell, Dowell, Crawford, Olimb, Leddy etc are being groomed in the minors for another 2-3 years. The 09-10 team with some wholesale changes over the next 7-10 years could result in 4-5 cups.
Just win the next game...!
There is a reason I am not a GM in the NHL.
I don’t disagree with much Stan did, the only thing in fact is not locking Hjalmarsson up early. I would have thought 2-2.5 for a 4-10 year term depending on what you could get him to agree to.
I love Niemi and I wish we didn’t lose him, I don’t think we are dead in the water and I won’t be shocked if Niemi isn’t playing in the NHL next year. If he is, it will be for around 2M if he is lucky. I think anything over 2.5M is too risky long term for him. Does he deserve it, absolutely.
I don’t disagree with getting rid of Bolland. I also see the value in keeping him, its a gamble with his back. Back problems never go away. Does losing him keep Ladd or Byfug….?
Losing Bolland does keep either Ladd or Buff.
But here’s what matters:
Bolland > Ladd > Byfuglien
by Ban on Aug 4, 2010 2:47 PM CDT up reply actions
I don't want to start a holy war here
but your equation needs some work. In no universe is Andrew Ladd considered more valuable than Byfuglien.
FifthFeather.com
by El Duque's Raft on Aug 4, 2010 3:35 PM CDT up reply actions
Ladd would have been cheaper, that is all I am saying between those 3.
You are short another Center without Bolland too.
more valuable to whom?
Are you saying you think Buff is more valuable than Ladd while playing on the Blackhawks? If that’s the case, then I can see your argument.
Buff vs. Ladd on Atlanta? At team like this, you need to make the playoffs first. I don’t think Byfuglien helps you get there, but Ladd sure as hell will.
‽ ⅋ ‽
In general as an NHL player
If Andrew Ladd is on your top 2 lines, you’re a bad team.
When all is said and done, Byfuglien will go down as the better player. Ladd is a role player; Byfuglien is not.
Durability also has to be brought into the equation in a comparison like this. Ladd has already suffered two significant injuries on his shoulder.
FifthFeather.com
by El Duque's Raft on Aug 4, 2010 4:28 PM CDT up reply actions
"Hey you, yeah you, the big guy....Go stand in front of the net
and if the puck comes near you, whack it toward the net."
That’s a role player if you ask me.
Ditto for CNS
please, explain to me
how Buff is not a role player. Also, if you don’t classify him as a role player, what would you classify him as?
See what I did there, I could have just replied “yes”, but where would that have gotten us?
Ditto for CNS
He's played on all 4 lines
he can play on the power play. To me, that’s something greater than a role player, i.e. Ladd who is the most effective on a checking line with no special team duties.
And breaking down his game as “go stand there and whack the puck in the net” is a bit too simple. We’ll see how easy the Hawks are able to do that next spring. If they can, then I’ll stand corrected.
FifthFeather.com
by El Duque's Raft on Aug 4, 2010 5:03 PM CDT up reply actions
yeah, this is just going to turn into a semantics argument
He’s a solid net presence on the powerplay. He’s not a great passer, sniper, or even puck winner. He has a role on the powerplay, to screen the goalie and knock in rebounds. I make it sound easy, and I know that it’s not. You have to be big, strong, and tough to be a good net presence, and Buff is that….during the playoffs.
I guess we’ll be in wait and see mode until next spring.
Ditto for CNS
Well he scored just as many goals as Ladd in the regular season
so I’m not sure why it’s great that Ladd scored 17 and not so great for Byfuglien.
In the playoffs, Byfuglien almost quadrupuled Ladd’s output but somehow people still prefer Ladd over him.
If you polled all 30 NHL GM’s on which player they’d rather have, it would probably be 100% tilted in Byfuglien’s favor.
FifthFeather.com
by El Duque's Raft on Aug 4, 2010 5:30 PM CDT up reply actions
I'll be interested to see what the Atlanta GM thinks
around march
Go jump in Toews Lake.
Aubrey: old German for king of the elves. Huff: English for...huff.
I think Ladd's 17 is better than Buff's 17
because Ladd is the better defensive player. A good checking line forward that can pot 17 is better than an average at best defensive forward that can pot 17.
Let’s not forget that Buff has been benched a couple times in the last 2 years for not bringing it, to my recollection that hasn’t happened with Ladd. That kind of stuff hurts a player’s value in my eyes.
Buff had a real good post season. 11 goals is nothing to scoff at, but his play this and last post season proves that he could and should score 30 a year. Maybe he’ll get there, maybe he won’t.
Ditto for CNS
As always with Buff it's about potential.
I think Ladd’s accomplishments come with him wringing just about every drop out of his talent pool.
Buff’s come with him scratching the surface.
I think Buff is one of the dominant players in the league if he plays each shift with anywhere near the drive and intensity with which Ladd plays every single shift.
But that’s a big IF.
"Life is a long lesson in humility."
- James M. Barrie
If we're voting, I'll take Byfuglien over Ladd.
I’m with El Duque .
Sure, he could disappear in the regular season. So do most players – at some time or another – in an 82 game season. But talent, size and potential of Byfuglien > Ladd. Over his career, he will have more game winners, more post-season points, and more devastating hits than Ladd. The points about realtive contract value and Atlanta’s chance at making the post season are valid – in the regular season, the sum of what Ladd offers (scoring, back-checking, hard work) is comparable to what you will probably get out of Byfuglien. But straight up? I take Byfuglien.
Awesome use of "statistics"
Particularly the cites of “he will have more game winners, more post – season points and more devastating hits…”
Yeah, and I can fart out cinnamon buns and make magic unicorns appear in the sky. Can I have some of what you’re drinking? Please come back and explain Einstein’s theory of relativity, in your own terms.
Einstein's theory of relativity??
He hasn’t even been born yet!
And can I have on of those bun buns?
Lord Stanley's new address: Sweet Home Chicago!
by ChicagoNativeSon on Aug 5, 2010 11:32 AM CDT up reply actions
Einstein's Theory of Relativity, for the layman:
I’m fast, you’re slow.
(i.e. the person moving at the speed of light sees others moving slowly but himself moving normally, while the person looking at person A feels himself moving normally and person A going really really fast)
by northernsails on Aug 8, 2010 2:14 AM CDT up reply actions
kinda like George Carlin's observation
two kinds of drivers:
idiots (anyone going slower than you)
maniacs (anyone going faster than you)
see, it’s all relative.
June 30, 2010. We will rue this day.
Well at Fifth Feather, Byfuglien > everyone so...
Joke joke.
Why I think Ladd is better:
He does all of the little things you expect out of a player that rarely get noticed. Buff does not. Ladd is much more responsible defensively and is better along the boards, which is sad when you consider that Buff used to play D. Their career +/- proves this.
Ladd doesn’t score the flashy goals like Buff does (Rangers OT goal for example) but in terms of point production, he beats Buff there as well. Buff’s career PPG is around .41 and Ladd is at .46. A slight difference, yes, but for the sake of productivity, Buff is better. If you include playoff productivity, Buff has the edge by .01 PPG, but factor in that he spent significant time with Toews and Kane while Ladd was on the checking line and you realize that given the same line and increased minutes, Ladd’s production would be higher.
Ladd is a role player. You’re right about that. But I have no idea what you’d consider Buff. He’s not really a role player but he’s not really a top forward. He’s just kinda there, much like how he spends the regular season.
by Ban on Aug 4, 2010 4:42 PM CDT up reply actions
If you remember back a few years ago when he was first acquired,
they tried putting Ladd with Toews and Kane and it was truly awful.
This Ladd love affair is a tad peculiar to me. You’re right, he does a lot of things that go unnoticed. He’s a solid, dependable winger with a ceiling of a 3rd line winger aka a player the Hawks rarely have trouble finding. Not sure why that makes him so beloved in those corners, but so be it.
Byfuglien, for all the things he gets harped on, is a weapon in a lot of different ways.
FifthFeather.com
by El Duque's Raft on Aug 4, 2010 5:00 PM CDT up reply actions
And in terms of career productivity
Ladd’s best season came while playing with Martin Havlat, the team’s best player at the time. So you can’t really say "Ladd’s production would be higher if he played with better players.
FifthFeather.com
by El Duque's Raft on Aug 4, 2010 5:09 PM CDT up reply actions
out of curiousity
why is Versteeg left out of this discussion?
Go jump in Toews Lake.
Aubrey: old German for king of the elves. Huff: English for...huff.
Because it wouldn't be fair to the others to be compared to him, in case they are reading this
Afroman likes tall cans.
by OMFS88 on Aug 4, 2010 11:01 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions
it takes two sides to sign a contract. hjalmarsson’s camp was under no obligation to sign a contract. he has until the first day of camp before it becomes a hold out. there was nothing that forced him to sign anything that was offered by the hawks.
still....
don’t you offer him a deal to lock him up? I think it is safe to say you could have locked him up for 2.5/year and feel pretty good about it. I’ve heard that much wasn’t even offered.
his point was
considering how much Hjalmarsson ended up signing for, do you think he would have signed for $2.5m? He and his agent must have had a number in mind, like the Hawks did, only the numbers weren’t the same. It’s not like the Hawks can slap a $2.5m offer on the table and force Hammer to sign it, which some people seem to think is how these things work.
But when it was suggested to him that Toews v. Kane seems likely to become a sidebar to every future international hockey tournament, he smiled and said: "I'd like us to win something together, too." -- 2/28/10, so our Captain has said, and so it was done.
(Tweets @ChiBlackhawks and blogs at Blackhawks Down Low.)
by chiblackhawks on Aug 4, 2010 4:15 PM CDT up reply actions
Nope, it's like some guy was saying a couple threads ago
The agents don’t give their clients any say… Sooooooo logically what Stan bowman needs to do now is either put his own or someone elses kids through law school, force them to become agents, and BOOM we sign whoever the hell we want for whatever we want
Afroman likes tall cans.
by OMFS88 on Aug 4, 2010 11:05 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions
Marty Turco's agent would like a word.
by Steven Schweickert on Aug 5, 2010 8:56 AM CDT up reply actions
No no no
Remember, when a player signs a contract with an agent they give up all rights, including their Miranda rights, right to vote, and their right to paaaarrrrtteee.
I heard here that’s what happened to Niemi. And I believe everything I read.
Lord Stanley's new address: Sweet Home Chicago!
by ChicagoNativeSon on Aug 5, 2010 11:37 AM CDT up reply actions
you also believe everything you make up
happy ninja is happy....and wants to share its new toy!
by puppetmasterp on Aug 5, 2010 11:40 AM CDT up reply actions
I've never made up anything - ever
Never did, never will. I don’t get you point??
Lord Stanley's new address: Sweet Home Chicago!
by ChicagoNativeSon on Aug 5, 2010 11:45 AM CDT up reply actions
So note to self.
After signing my next big deal into rock superstardom it goes career and massive overwhelming success, followed by massive crack and drug addiction, all while avoiding police, election booths and showing up at frat houses plastered beyond recognition. Good to know.
by Steven Schweickert on Aug 5, 2010 11:42 AM CDT up reply actions
where's Jerry Maguire when you need him, huh?
But when it was suggested to him that Toews v. Kane seems likely to become a sidebar to every future international hockey tournament, he smiled and said: "I'd like us to win something together, too." -- 2/28/10, so our Captain has said, and so it was done.
(Tweets @ChiBlackhawks and blogs at Blackhawks Down Low.)
by chiblackhawks on Aug 5, 2010 11:43 AM CDT up reply actions
And off wandering goes my active imagination...
Antti “Scarface” MacGuire
In this country, you gotta get an agent first. Then when you get the agent, you lose the the power. Then when you lose the power, then you become an unrestricted free agent.
You wanna waste my time? Okay. I call my agent. He’s the best agent in Chicago. He’s such a good agent, that by tomorrow morning, you gonna be working in Atlanta. So dress cool.
Here pelicans, pelicans, pelicans. Come on, pelicans! Fly, fly away!
What’d you think of that, huh? What you think, I’m a fucking worm like you? I told you, man, I told you! Don’t fuck with me! I told you, no fucking arbitration! No, but you wouldn’t listen, why, you stupid fuck, look at you now.
Sanitation? I told you to tell ’em that I was in arbitration, not sanitation, arbitration.
You wanna fuck with me? Okay. You wanna play rough? Say hello to my little friend. (opens trench coat, out comes Zito)
Lord Stanley's new address: Sweet Home Chicago!
by ChicagoNativeSon on Aug 5, 2010 12:07 PM CDT up reply actions 2 recs
Brillliant!
"It's the Chicago Blackhawks man." - Jeremy Roenick
by The Fearless Freep on Aug 5, 2010 1:20 PM CDT up reply actions
Rec'd
Although I get a more “Niemi as schoolyard pedo” vibe from this. And what the hell is Zito doing in his trench coat?
by Steven Schweickert on Aug 5, 2010 1:27 PM CDT up reply actions
I guess
all I am saying is make the offer. If I was bowman, having to pinch pennies or not my goal was to use Huets Salary and convert it into Hjalmarsson and Niemi. Starting around 2.5 each. From everything I have read and heard they were playing the waiting game with Hjalmarsson or low balling. It cost them and I think that is the only bad move Bowman made.
what makes you think that Bowman DIDN'T make the offer
and that Hjalmarsson’s side just rejected it? It’s from “everything you heard” and the thing is, that holds just as much water as me hearing the offers were $9m/3yrs or $14 (or was it $13?) for 5.
But when it was suggested to him that Toews v. Kane seems likely to become a sidebar to every future international hockey tournament, he smiled and said: "I'd like us to win something together, too." -- 2/28/10, so our Captain has said, and so it was done.
(Tweets @ChiBlackhawks and blogs at Blackhawks Down Low.)
by chiblackhawks on Aug 5, 2010 11:47 AM CDT up reply actions
everything is hear say
Going back and forth in email with Jessie Rogers, he said he spoke to Hjalmarsson agent and those deals were not offered.
that is probably the first thing you should have said up front
although we still don’t know for sure whether or not Hammer would have signed for $2.5
But when it was suggested to him that Toews v. Kane seems likely to become a sidebar to every future international hockey tournament, he smiled and said: "I'd like us to win something together, too." -- 2/28/10, so our Captain has said, and so it was done.
(Tweets @ChiBlackhawks and blogs at Blackhawks Down Low.)
by chiblackhawks on Aug 5, 2010 1:40 PM CDT up reply actions
Right
wouldn’t Wilson have spoken to Hjammer’s agent to get an idea what he was looking for in terms of pay? Or is that not allowed, and Wilson just guessed he would sign at $3.5?
it would have been allowed post-July 1, I think
But when it was suggested to him that Toews v. Kane seems likely to become a sidebar to every future international hockey tournament, he smiled and said: "I'd like us to win something together, too." -- 2/28/10, so our Captain has said, and so it was done.
(Tweets @ChiBlackhawks and blogs at Blackhawks Down Low.)
by chiblackhawks on Aug 5, 2010 1:46 PM CDT up reply actions
The Hawks don’t have the luxury of just slapping an offer on the table like 2.5/year (which is slightly overmarket for a RFA on his second contract and Hjalmarrson’s #‘s). They need to squeeze every guy for as low as they can go, specifically RFA’s.
Sure, it’s different than the way things have operated in the past couple years but this is the world they’ve created for themselves.
FifthFeather.com
by El Duque's Raft on Aug 4, 2010 4:22 PM CDT up reply actions
I hope bad feelings don't exist between the front office and Jammer
Not that I think they will, but you never know, they could be pissed at his holding their feet to the fire after signing that offer sheet.
It's Pretty Clear that We All Really Love This Team...
I miss hockey everyday and really appreciate all of the passion and discussion here and around the UC. This never ending faux GM dialogue is really interesting to read. Sincerely.
Taking a step back to re-evaluate the choices made, I wonder what this forum would do differently knowing how it all played out…
I personally think that this Team was much bigger than any one or two players. Everyone contributed on and off the ice. And to gut the roster of this many players I fear will be a mistake. There was no wishing the cap issue away, but I wonder if you could have many tougher calls and kept more of the nucleus.
So to that end… It’s clear that Huet had to go (no issue with the $5 of relief),IMO I would have tried to move Soupy packaged with another talent solely because of the $7 cap number (a highly unlikely move but worth every effort and maybe only possible with a partner in the trade), and I would have considered moving Kaner. To Buffalo or TO for example.
If you could have done those 3, you would have met the cap issues and could have kept Buff, Verstegg, Ladd and Fraser (if you wanted him vs a Rockford kid). You could also have kept both Hammer and Niemi as well at their current numbers or at a more proactive $5-5.5 that it likely would have cost us. You lose 2 amazing talents requiring Hammer and Verstegg to step up, but you would have kept more of the core team character in place.
I think that Burke takes that deal in TO given the pressure of running that team in that market.
What would others have done differently?
Trading Kane, really?
You can replace Buff, Ladd, Versteeg, and of course Fraser. Sure, it might take a year or two, but you can find guys like that in your system.
You can’t replace Patrick fucking Kane.
"I have only space enough to add: against the assault of desperate pandas nothing can stand."
-ChicoMaki (channeling Mark Twain)
by HungryHungryPanda on Aug 4, 2010 10:38 PM CDT up reply actions
not the only time i've heard that
heard some guys on ESPN 1000 advocating the same a couple months ago. Their thought was that Kaner has peaked (which i think is not an accurate estimation consider he’s not 23 yet) and so the best thing to do was to trade him while his value was high.
Good news is that his value is still high…so, you know…if we want to….
um, never mind.
happy ninja is happy....and wants to share its new toy!
by puppetmasterp on Aug 4, 2010 10:53 PM CDT up reply actions
Following that logic
This is clearly the time to trade Keith and Toews as well. Best thing Keith does in the next few years would be to win the Norris, which he has already done. It’s either plateau or downhill from here. Toews simply cannot win a gold medal, Stanley cup, Olympic MVP, and conn smythe for ANOTHER 4 years. Who has that kind if time? Sounds like another guy who has plateaued! Their trade values may never be this high again…
Afroman likes tall cans.
by OMFS88 on Aug 4, 2010 11:11 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions
He’s not even 22 yet!
Trade Stamkos! Trade Tavares! Trade Duchene!
"I have only space enough to add: against the assault of desperate pandas nothing can stand."
-ChicoMaki (channeling Mark Twain)
by HungryHungryPanda on Aug 5, 2010 8:28 AM CDT up reply actions
"kept more of the nucleus"
and by that, who do you mean? By your username, I’m guessing you mean Niemi? I’m sorry, I love Nemo and I would’ve loved to keep him, but he was not part of the nucleus. Neither was Ladd, Buff, Steeger, Sopes, Eags, Bur, or Frazz.
Our nucleus is Toews, Kane, Keith. To that we still have Hossa, Sharp, Bolland, Brouwer, Seabs, Campbell, and Hjalmarsson.
If we’re following the Red Wings model, our goalie will never be in the nucleus. If we’re following the Canucks model, then sure, the goalie is in there. Personally, I’ll stick with the Red Wings model, thanks.
I had the same reaction
when I read “kept more of the nucleus.” Ladd, Buff, Versteeg, etc. are all very good players and were very important in our winning the Cup, but they were not the nucleus of our team.
"Every player should be accorded the privilege of at least one season with the Chicago Cubs. That's baseball as it should be played - in God's own sunshine. And that's really living." -- Alvin Dark
As mentioned above
it comes down to which skill sets are more readily replaced.
Toews, Kane, Hossa, Keith, et al. These players skills are not easily duplicated. (One might say these are once in a generation players.)
Most of those that have gone elsewhere have skill levels that can be found in players elsewhere in the league or be developed in youngsters in our system.
It’s just a pracitcal matter of keeping the best that you have.
"Life is a long lesson in humility."
- James M. Barrie
Sophie's Choice
I’m not sitting here screaming dump Kaner to keep Nemo… trust me I get how special Kane is. It’s not even close what you have to do with that choice. I’m not sure any goalie in the NHL is worth making a $7/year commitment, so I’m not advocating a Vancouver model. IMO, we could of had him for $2.5/year if we had moved faster.
Looking at it now, I simply wondered whether you’d play the hand the same way. I wouldn’t. Given the crappy position of having to make painful calls, I think we would have been better off keeping 3-4 players instead of one. My wonder was how close could Verstegg have gotten to the same game (80%) and then you still would have had Buff, Ladd, and Nemo as well. The NHL is definitely not the NBA, were one guy can win a cup. Superstars may sell jerseys, but I believe O lines win Superbowls. And I feel like we traded away most of our O line. I hope I am wrong, but Kaner hasn’t yet shown anything close to Ovechkin/ Crosby-like capabilities. My only “you can’t replace” guys on this team are Keith and Toews.
O lines may or may not win Super Bowls
but Defense wins Cups. And we only traded our #5 defenseman, who was overpaid in spite of his contributions.
by Katherine215 on Aug 5, 2010 11:44 AM CDT up reply actions
O lines win super bowls?
tell that to the Baltimore Ravens. And the Steelers. And even the ’85 Bears in a Super Bowl where Walter Payton was awfully quite…. to me
defense : Super Bowls :: pitching : World Series
happy ninja is happy....and wants to share its new toy!
by puppetmasterp on Aug 5, 2010 1:11 PM CDT up reply actions
I agree with you for the most part
which is why I said may or may not. Of course, one could argue that the Bears D was beat by the Colts O, but one could also argue the Bears D was not as good as it thought it was.
"the Bears D was not as good as it thought it was"
There’s the tagline for the last quarter century of bears football.
Ditto for CNS
Which reminds me..
If “the Bears are who we thought they were”…
Why didn’t Dennis Green just have his QB kneel three times, then punt the ball out of bounds on every possession the rest of that game once they had the 23-3 lead?
by The Deputy Mayor of Rush Street on Aug 5, 2010 3:42 PM CDT up reply actions
Wasn't that the
game plan used in The Waterboy?
Maybe, just once, someone will call me 'Sir' without adding, 'You're making a scene."
2006
It was the Bears defeating the Arizona Cardinals. The Cardinals’ coach, Dennis Green, subsequently lost it in the post-game press conference, and some of his quotes live in infamy. I’ll try to find some for you.
Found one on Wikipedia
The Bears are who we thought they were, and that’s why we took the damn field. Now, if you want to crown them, then crown their ass! But, they are who we thought they were, and we let them off the hook!
Does… does that even make sense?
Actually it does (to me anyway)
That season, the Bears were off to a good start but weren’t playing as great as the media would have you believe. Phoenix dominated the first half of the game and the Bears looked awful. Long story short, the Bears came back and the Phoenix coach blew up after the game.
Maybe, just once, someone will call me 'Sir' without adding, 'You're making a scene."
oh, yeah, that's it
you can hear him say it in the link i posted above.
He basically was saying he didn’t think the team was that good and that’s why they took the field to compete. Or something. Crown them was referring to the press saying the Bears were the best in the league i think, or something similar to that. The win kept the Bears undefeated and there was already talk they were pretty good. Lies, all lies… Letting them off the hook referred to blowing the ginormous lead.
It was hilarious if you were a Bears fan, though it was troubling to see such a Jekyl/Hyde act from the team, especially the Defense.
Right
now that I’ve got the context, I understand what he meant.
I know more about American Football & how it’s played than most Brits, but I don’t know much about the NFL or current teams/rosters or anything.
well, all you really need to know
is the Bears will disappoint you every year, Brett Favre will threaten to retire every year, and Terrell Owens will talk or play himself off another team every year. it’s pretty simple, really. ;)
Even better.. the offense didn't do a blessed thing
The Bears scored on two fumble recoveries for touchdowns, and then an 85-yard Devin Hester punt return with about 5 minutes left in the game.
(And then the Bears’ defense tried to give the game back, but Arizona missed a last-second field goal.)
by The Deputy Mayor of Rush Street on Aug 5, 2010 4:31 PM CDT up reply actions
Damn, it really has been 25 years.
I feel old. And I’m getting excited for football season, which is always a recipe for crushing disappointment around here.
Look at the bright side
hockey starts one month after the Bears so your excitement for the them will be replaced by the Hawks
Maybe, just once, someone will call me 'Sir' without adding, 'You're making a scene."
I refused to get excited for this bears season
probably because I was in attendance for the Arizona and Cincy games last year (in Cincy I might add), and they were the most pathetic displays of defense I’ve ever seen. Our linebackers are healthy this year and we’ve got peppers, but I think it’ll take more than that to improve that garbage I saw last year. Plus, the O-line is no better than last year and the bears absolutely couldn’t run the ball then, I don’t see how they are going to now.
All that said, I’d love for them to surprise me, but I’m prepared for disappointment.
Ditto for CNS
I can't help it,
I still get my hopes up for the Bears just like I do for the Cubs every year. Some day I will be rewarded!
I actualy meant to reply to Niemi Nation
that’s who the my comment was directed at, but it was a continuation of your thought.
happy ninja is happy....and wants to share its new toy!
by puppetmasterp on Aug 5, 2010 1:58 PM CDT up reply actions
oh and that was the year the Colts had some semblance of D, as opposed to most prior years where they were all offense. And even then, it didn’t take much D at that to overcome the offensive genius that was Rex Grossman.
happy ninja is happy....and wants to share its new toy!
by puppetmasterp on Aug 5, 2010 2:00 PM CDT up reply actions
I blame the "D"
more than I blame Grossman for that loss.
Maybe, just once, someone will call me 'Sir' without adding, 'You're making a scene."
there's blood on everyone's hands from that loss
Grossman, Chris Harris, the D line, Lovie, Chico, Turner
Ditto for CNS
In American Football
are there playoff series(es) leading up to the Superbowl, or is it one-game things as well?
It's more or less a single elimination tournament.
One game, win and you move on, lose and see ya next year.
by Steven Schweickert on Aug 5, 2010 3:22 PM CDT up reply actions
Oh yeah
I forgot teams only play like 12 games/season not counting playoffs. Having series would make the postseason last forever.
Well, 16 games over 17 weeks (each team gets a bye week)
But yeah, even if you did 2-out-of-3… Good lord see you in late March.
by Steven Schweickert on Aug 5, 2010 3:53 PM CDT up reply actions
Just like Ohio State
in the Orange Bowl that year
Maybe, just once, someone will call me 'Sir' without adding, 'You're making a scene."
Grossman was not that bad overall.
I also blame the defense more than I blamed him, though he did not have a good game. One player, Bob Sanders, made the difference for the Colts’ D and fortunatley for them, he came back in time. Unfortunately for us, our one player who made the D line work, Tommie Harris, has been one big disappointment from that game on.
god knows I love Steeger
but he could never step up to fill in Kane’s skates. It’s just not there.
But when it was suggested to him that Toews v. Kane seems likely to become a sidebar to every future international hockey tournament, he smiled and said: "I'd like us to win something together, too." -- 2/28/10, so our Captain has said, and so it was done.
(Tweets @ChiBlackhawks and blogs at Blackhawks Down Low.)
by chiblackhawks on Aug 5, 2010 11:50 AM CDT up reply actions
Agreed
He just doesn’t have the same hockey savvy.
hockey savy not there
and the vision certainly isn’t there. Steeg has good hands, but I don’t think he will ever be a great playmaker because he doesn’t have elite on ice vision.
Ditto for CNS
IMO, we could of (sic) had him for $2.5/year if we had moved faster.
How? Apparently the ‘Hawks offered him a $8mil/3 years deal ($2.6mil/year) & that got rejected. The only other way is if you’re suggesting a long Cap-friendly deal like Keith, Hossa, etc., which – I’ll admit – is a possibility, but giving such a thing to a player who’s only played 50-odd NHL games could work out hilariously badly.
Think about what might’ve happened had Andrew Raycroft been given a long-term deal like that after his ‘03-’04 season where he posted 2.05GAA, .926 SV% in the reg season & 2.15GAA, .924SV% in the playoffs.
Intersting question
but you admit that moving Huet would be impossible – Campbell, unfortunately, is probably nearly as difficult. Don’t get me wrong, I love Campbell, but that contract of his is still wildly overpriced in the market today for offensive-minded defensemen.
So while it is an interesting and not entirely silly idea, I agree with most of the above retorts / responses – moving Byfuglien et al was painful, but it was the least painful of all the alternatives, and left the Hawks with the best chance of competing (or even repeating) in ‘10-’11 and beyond.
Give it a few years
We might look at Soupy’s contract at that time as actually being in line for top – flight defensemen. I used to think he was “wildly overpriced,” but after the just – concluded insane – fest regarding D guys, I’m rethinking that position. You also have to remember the time and context of when that contract was offered – no one (and I repeat NO ONE) wanted to come play for the Hawks, no matter how many dollars were being waved in front of their faces. Tallon overpaid because he basically had to – witness the Islander’s recent offer to a mediocre defensemen yesterday.
San Jose Mercury drooling at Niemi
The Sharks, according to www.nhlnumbers.com, have a little more than $4 million in salary-cap space. Still unsigned is unrestricted forward Jed Ortmeyer, whom Wilson pegged as a priority heading into the offseason. Also, we must presume Wilson would like to add a defenseman after his failed attempt to filch restricted free agent Niklas Hjalmarsson from the Blackhawks.
I predict Nemo goes to Montreal
"What doesn't kill us makes us stronger."
FtF however
is adamant that Niemi won’t end up in San Jose (i think one of their bloggers actually called the idea something along the lines of ridiculous).
FYI — best line from that article:
“And for what it’s worth, Niemi’s agent, Bill Zito, already has disclosed that dozens, maybe hundreds of NHL teams are lining up to speak with his client.”
happy ninja is happy....and wants to share its new toy!
by puppetmasterp on Aug 4, 2010 9:44 PM CDT up reply actions
That would be hilarious
…if one of the recent reports regarding his worry about being recognized too much in public was true. Hell, Montreal is the last place on earth you go to play if you don’t want too much scrutiny. They not only will recognize the guy 24/7, they might torch his car if he stinks up the playoffs.
based on the fact price is not accepting offers...
getting niemi is a big FU to price
"What doesn't kill us makes us stronger."
yes, it would...
but a team with motive and a need to sign him… most teams are committed to 2 goalies… including Dale Tallon
this is like a Greek tragedy…
"What doesn't kill us makes us stronger."
Speaking of...
Anyone know if the Montreal Cop Car still has a Twitter account? Or is it still too much of a smoking charred mess to tweet?
by Steven Schweickert on Aug 5, 2010 8:59 AM CDT up reply actions
A nice read about our new netminder
From Defending Big D
by hawkswin!hawkswin! on Aug 4, 2010 11:42 PM CDT reply actions
did you notice in the last video who the opposing all-star goalie was?
aww, to have fallen so far from grace…
Cool video there at the bottom
Huet, Turco, Campbell, Hossa, and Havlat. Any other current or former Hawks that I missed? Turco seems like a really cool guy, I’m excited for this year.
"I have only space enough to add: against the assault of desperate pandas nothing can stand."
-ChicoMaki (channeling Mark Twain)
by HungryHungryPanda on Aug 5, 2010 8:44 AM CDT up reply actions
Turco the Cool guy
Roy was not a cool guy. Sort of an ass, if you ask me. He was however awesome. I’ll take an asshole like Roy (or Brodeur) over a cool guy any day. Huet is a cool guy too.
If Turco can take the cool guy vibe and put a little asshole on top, I think this year will be like last year.
That and no injuries to Toews, Bolland, Sharp, Seabrook, or Keith.
Holy Crap!
Yeah, let's trade Kane while we still can
Shaking my head over that one – in what alternate reality does that kind of thought process exist?
James Wisnewski signed for 3.25m...
HAHHAHAHHAHHAHAHHAHAHH
deep breath….
HAHHAHAHHAHAHA
Happy we didn’t have to pay 5 million for Hammer then. Man, the Isles are terrible.
And Wizzer and Seabs
are yet again tied by NHL fate. Dammit Hack, he already hurt Seabs and the Hawks once.
by Steven Schweickert on Aug 5, 2010 12:55 PM CDT up reply actions
True...
I think all of us are expecting Seabrook to land somewhere in the 5 million a year ballpark. Maybe a bit less with a hometown discount.
by Northside_Dan on Aug 5, 2010 12:59 PM CDT up reply actions
Now where are all those telling us how insane Soupy's contract is now?
Granted he’s still overpriced – but given the recent nuttiness, by how much? Perhaps 2 MM? 1.5?
Over priced
by the value of exactly one inexperienced goalie who won a cup.
Who might not have won the cup without said overpriced player
Really easy to play that game
by Northside_Dan on Aug 5, 2010 1:29 PM CDT up reply actions
No way the Hawks win without Campbell.
Were you watching the whole playoffs?
Campbell caueses the sort of defensive problems for other teams that they cannot answer. He is like a 4th forward when he’s out there. He’s way above average even strength defensively. Top it off by his PP abiity
No Way the Hawks beat NSH, Van, SJ, or PHI without him.
Holy Crap!
the best part about campbell is
unlike the Caps, we don’t have to rely on him as our top dman so he can go do his thing.
But when it was suggested to him that Toews v. Kane seems likely to become a sidebar to every future international hockey tournament, he smiled and said: "I'd like us to win something together, too." -- 2/28/10, so our Captain has said, and so it was done.
(Tweets @ChiBlackhawks and blogs at Blackhawks Down Low.)
by chiblackhawks on Aug 5, 2010 2:02 PM CDT up reply actions
Thst's why DK won the Norris
He does both.
I love our D. It’s the no bullshit part of the team.
Holy Crap!
I want one of his game day checks too
It’s got to be 100 grand or more.
long haired bastard
Holy Crap!
Eh, more or less 88K per regular season game.
by Steven Schweickert on Aug 5, 2010 2:23 PM CDT up reply actions
by cap hit or actual salary?
$8,000,000 / 82 games is more than you are saying and less than I’m saying.
I thought he was making 9mil this year
Holy Crap!
I was going by 7.25 (which I thought was his cap hit).
Last year’s 1.9 Made figure got him about 23K per game. This year’s 8 Made figure is gonna get him about 97~98K.
by Steven Schweickert on Aug 5, 2010 2:55 PM CDT up reply actions
Toews, Kane and Keith
Made $3,625,000 in combined salary last year (not counting $5m in bonuses on the entry-level contracts).
They make $21,000,000 in combined salaries this coming season.
17 million dollars buys a lot of experienced roleplayers, Mr. and Mrs. Capocalypse.
by The Deputy Mayor of Rush Street on Aug 5, 2010 3:56 PM CDT up reply actions
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